Aug 19 2012: Well even if the leverage and standpoint were there, I'd choose not to move it as it could have a damaging effect to an entire planet - earth in this case. Therefore ones conscious intent is imperative towards choice, and should be accountable at the time of choice. Of course if ego ruled my consciousness then I'd move the moon and gain fame and soon after gain blame. So there appears to be a price attached to ego. Thus chasing perfection should be towards ones awareness or consciousness as some call it, rather than trying to perfect elsewhere
Aug 19 2012: If religions are going to be taught in schools (which it shouldn't) it has to be done without bias. That would mean all religions to be taught, bar none, presenting facts - advantages and disadvantages of religions.
The study should show the founders teachings, and the history vs the interpretations over the centuries. There certainly is a huge disparity between how writings are interpreted vs what it intended, therefore should be a matter of ones own conlusions, and not manipulated conclusions.
A very important part of it should present the differences in beliefs by other or apposing religions - religious skeptiscm. The student should be aware of the definition of religious skeptiscm and should not be confused with atheism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_skepticism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skepticism#Religious_skepticism
From this the student can develop an understanding of the disadvantages as well as the advantages. Once this is established we could easily understand the intolerances affecting the diversity in societies. To put it simply, everyone is guilty of intolerance, especially found within religions.
The problem arises then - how does a school teach, or find the time to teach 11000odd religions and denominations? Rather we focus on dexterous and adept skills to improve our well-being as we are certainly in need of a more productive people than that of a destructive people, as our forefathers were.
I'd like to know how can religion be seen as natural phenomenon if it was orchestrated through a process of manipulation?
Aug 19 2012: Personally I think if God (if existed) had a numerical value assigned to him/her then 0 (zero) would fit perfectly because.
1 = Creation
Zero has no value UNLESS a value is added 1+0 = 1
If the value is subtracted then it's no value - no thing - nothing
and since 1+1 = 2 and does not require a zero to add value we can assume that 1 (creation) has greater value.
Another way to look at it is
1+9 = 10
The zero defines a new cycle in this instance but still has no value because 10-19 describes the next repeated cycle as 1-9
Conclusion
1 = creation
0 = god
An analogy
If nothing - no thing existed, sand, water, planets, people and so forth, didn't exist - can we say that God exist? We cannot say this because we are not here to recognize it or claim it. Therefore without anything it's nothing = 0.
So who created the 0? We did
Why was the 0 created? To improve our value??? No, to define a cycle
Where did it all begin then?
At 1-9 and evolved to 10-19 and
20-29
30-39.....
40-49
50-59
60-69
70-79
80-89
90-99
Aug 19 2012: As Pat pointed out, Capital Investment, being the issue. Educated people, if they venture into business, can be held back if there isn't capital to fund their projects which affects more depending on how many job were expected to come out of it.
I'm not sure if it the same everywhere else, but here (South Africa) we have raw minerals and produce product however China purchases a large amount of the raw minerals and produce yet they supply us cheaper than our local suppliers. I would assume that our demands are greater here, as in people expect better wage and more so the investors are expecting a specific return on investment. Of course the everday running cost as well. All that adds to cost. So in the end the product vs the imported product costs more because the labour and admin costs are greater than that abroad.
Then we should recognize that governments are responsible for allowing imports to affect the local market. Duties should be set at a rate that keeps to fair pricing between local and import, in that way giving people a choice. Another issue being free trade...everyone is free to import and this seems to be a contributing factor because they operate as a one man show and markups to suite the "one man" vs an organization who caters for perhaps 50 people. How does an establishment compete with that?
Another issue could be over-population. Can any country cater for all their people? If they can't cater for their people then it becomes another profitable labour force for investors, provided the politics are in favor of investors. People are seen as a resource and if people have too much freedom and rights in a country then it's an issue for investors.
Aug 18 2012: The big concern is what we support vs what they support.
Are there disagreements? If there are, do we allow 'our' ethics to hold them in contempt. If it does, then we fail the very thing we try to define - ETHICS.
Aug 18 2012: The man in the mirror message references the - self before blaming others. If we all did that we'd all be more accountable for our chaotic world.
Your question on can we move the moon - Archimedes said, give me a place to stand and I'll move the Earth. So he was referring leverage. Do you have a place where I could stand to move that moon?
Aug 18 2012: Not to worry I don't feel any of it rude, I welcome all expressions and vents.
To clear the consultation part - I meant it stink because we DON'T consult, we don't agree if we tried. This particularly pointed at religions who are up in arms with each other. Examples - Burma crisis, Israel and Palestine and more.
To clear APATHY - it is the submission of ones Will that causes societies the loss they experiencing. When 'smarter' ones note the - laid back attitude - they endevour to lead people for their own gain and corruption becomes prevalent . They know that very few, if any, would stand up for justice and march for freedom, therefore they take society for granted. This is what apathy is - it is an unresponsive people that I'm referring to. If people were responsive we wouldn't have such great degeneracy. I'm not saying poverty is the poor man's fault but I'm saying they have the POWER TO CHANGE their situation - if they begin to respond.
The question is - where does apathy reside, and where/what brought it into existence?
We are so comfortable allowing podium teachers to decide our fate, and when we hear a few in the crowd complaining, we shy away from standing for the same ideals, especially if they are intended to help us. We are too QUIET when we should be LOUD and to damn loud when we should quiet - listen.
Bottomline is - the seekers for unity in diversity have a very difficult task on their hands, because of - PRIDE amongst those they hope to unite.
It reminds me of that song of Michael Jackson - Man in the Mirror
"I'm Starting With The Man In The Mirror
I'm Asking Him To Change His Ways
And No Message Could Have Been Any Clearer
If You Wanna Make The World A Better Place"
Aug 18 2012: Faisal I think the answer most are looking lies in nature. Nature is a beautiful existence, it has more wisdom to share than any single 'authority' who imagine and tell. It's unfathomable, it's endless and infinite and peaceful in its own right...or should I say rite?
The greatest discovery in nature is discovering our small part in this infinite, yet recognize the big role we play in it and how our decision could affect or comply. This is where we begin to loose ego. We are just a drop in the ocean comparatively speaking. Science confirms this on so many levels. We can find it through a telescope, a microscope and even within our own minds and we continue to glean that no side is too big or too small and neither can we confirm that we are in the middle. It's a collective, and absolutum that makes it all possible.
I'm sure it must be an intrinsic battle to make that shift. As for the wisdom of Jesus, I believe he should be, in character, an exemplar to his following. He stood up for human rights and that's all I need as truth from any man who risks his life for society. However it's sad that over the millennia his cause was distorted into what it is today. The same with sages like Martin Luther, Ghandi and the like, they supposed a system of government and tried their utmost to uplift society.
Books are boons for us to reflect upon and hopefully not repeat the failures of past societies, and if we turn them into 'holy' then we fail to reflect.
Here's a saying I live by - the pain we carry as a society, is the love we withhold from each other.
Great ruins lie on this planet as evidence of this withholding love from each other. That is the essence I get from our history. I leave out the fancy trimmings.
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A comment on Conversation: What if, in a fine morning, you learn, "There's nothing called God"!
A comment on Talk: Dan Dennett: Responding to Pastor Rick Warren
The study should show the founders teachings, and the history vs the interpretations over the centuries. There certainly is a huge disparity between how writings are interpreted vs what it intended, therefore should be a matter of ones own conlusions, and not manipulated conclusions.
A very important part of it should present the differences in beliefs by other or apposing religions - religious skeptiscm. The student should be aware of the definition of religious skeptiscm and should not be confused with atheism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_skepticism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skepticism#Religious_skepticism
From this the student can develop an understanding of the disadvantages as well as the advantages. Once this is established we could easily understand the intolerances affecting the diversity in societies. To put it simply, everyone is guilty of intolerance, especially found within religions.
The problem arises then - how does a school teach, or find the time to teach 11000odd religions and denominations? Rather we focus on dexterous and adept skills to improve our well-being as we are certainly in need of a more productive people than that of a destructive people, as our forefathers were.
I'd like to know how can religion be seen as natural phenomenon if it was orchestrated through a process of manipulation?
A comment on Conversation: Georg Cantor was wrong about infinity. Greatest Mistake in History True Infinity explained
1 = Creation
Zero has no value UNLESS a value is added 1+0 = 1
If the value is subtracted then it's no value - no thing - nothing
and since 1+1 = 2 and does not require a zero to add value we can assume that 1 (creation) has greater value.
Another way to look at it is
1+9 = 10
The zero defines a new cycle in this instance but still has no value because 10-19 describes the next repeated cycle as 1-9
Conclusion
1 = creation
0 = god
An analogy
If nothing - no thing existed, sand, water, planets, people and so forth, didn't exist - can we say that God exist? We cannot say this because we are not here to recognize it or claim it. Therefore without anything it's nothing = 0.
So who created the 0? We did
Why was the 0 created? To improve our value??? No, to define a cycle
Where did it all begin then?
At 1-9 and evolved to 10-19 and
20-29
30-39.....
40-49
50-59
60-69
70-79
80-89
90-99
Note the 1-9 cycles On left
A reply on Conversation: Does America have an unemployment crisis? If so, then how would you solve the unemployment crisis?
I'm not sure if it the same everywhere else, but here (South Africa) we have raw minerals and produce product however China purchases a large amount of the raw minerals and produce yet they supply us cheaper than our local suppliers. I would assume that our demands are greater here, as in people expect better wage and more so the investors are expecting a specific return on investment. Of course the everday running cost as well. All that adds to cost. So in the end the product vs the imported product costs more because the labour and admin costs are greater than that abroad.
Then we should recognize that governments are responsible for allowing imports to affect the local market. Duties should be set at a rate that keeps to fair pricing between local and import, in that way giving people a choice. Another issue being free trade...everyone is free to import and this seems to be a contributing factor because they operate as a one man show and markups to suite the "one man" vs an organization who caters for perhaps 50 people. How does an establishment compete with that?
Another issue could be over-population. Can any country cater for all their people? If they can't cater for their people then it becomes another profitable labour force for investors, provided the politics are in favor of investors. People are seen as a resource and if people have too much freedom and rights in a country then it's an issue for investors.
A comment on Conversation: Is there an exact, definite criteria or standard on ethics?
Are there disagreements? If there are, do we allow 'our' ethics to hold them in contempt. If it does, then we fail the very thing we try to define - ETHICS.
A comment on Conversation: What if, in a fine morning, you learn, "There's nothing called God"!
Your question on can we move the moon - Archimedes said, give me a place to stand and I'll move the Earth. So he was referring leverage. Do you have a place where I could stand to move that moon?
A comment on Conversation: What if, in a fine morning, you learn, "There's nothing called God"!
To clear the consultation part - I meant it stink because we DON'T consult, we don't agree if we tried. This particularly pointed at religions who are up in arms with each other. Examples - Burma crisis, Israel and Palestine and more.
To clear APATHY - it is the submission of ones Will that causes societies the loss they experiencing. When 'smarter' ones note the - laid back attitude - they endevour to lead people for their own gain and corruption becomes prevalent . They know that very few, if any, would stand up for justice and march for freedom, therefore they take society for granted. This is what apathy is - it is an unresponsive people that I'm referring to. If people were responsive we wouldn't have such great degeneracy. I'm not saying poverty is the poor man's fault but I'm saying they have the POWER TO CHANGE their situation - if they begin to respond.
The question is - where does apathy reside, and where/what brought it into existence?
We are so comfortable allowing podium teachers to decide our fate, and when we hear a few in the crowd complaining, we shy away from standing for the same ideals, especially if they are intended to help us. We are too QUIET when we should be LOUD and to damn loud when we should quiet - listen.
Bottomline is - the seekers for unity in diversity have a very difficult task on their hands, because of - PRIDE amongst those they hope to unite.
A reply on Conversation: What if, in a fine morning, you learn, "There's nothing called God"!
It reminds me of that song of Michael Jackson - Man in the Mirror
"I'm Starting With The Man In The Mirror
I'm Asking Him To Change His Ways
And No Message Could Have Been Any Clearer
If You Wanna Make The World A Better Place"
:-)
A comment on Conversation: What if, in a fine morning, you learn, "There's nothing called God"!
The greatest discovery in nature is discovering our small part in this infinite, yet recognize the big role we play in it and how our decision could affect or comply. This is where we begin to loose ego. We are just a drop in the ocean comparatively speaking. Science confirms this on so many levels. We can find it through a telescope, a microscope and even within our own minds and we continue to glean that no side is too big or too small and neither can we confirm that we are in the middle. It's a collective, and absolutum that makes it all possible.
A reply on Conversation: Is intelligent design science and should it be taught in public schools?
I'm sure it must be an intrinsic battle to make that shift. As for the wisdom of Jesus, I believe he should be, in character, an exemplar to his following. He stood up for human rights and that's all I need as truth from any man who risks his life for society. However it's sad that over the millennia his cause was distorted into what it is today. The same with sages like Martin Luther, Ghandi and the like, they supposed a system of government and tried their utmost to uplift society.
Books are boons for us to reflect upon and hopefully not repeat the failures of past societies, and if we turn them into 'holy' then we fail to reflect.
Here's a saying I live by - the pain we carry as a society, is the love we withhold from each other.
Great ruins lie on this planet as evidence of this withholding love from each other. That is the essence I get from our history. I leave out the fancy trimmings.
Peace in wisdom will get us there