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James Kindler

Mental Health Recovery Coordinator,

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How do we get corporations out of government.

Large corperations run our government, thay donate huge amounts of money for which they are rewarded. The government no longer represents the people but rather the corporations. We are supposed to be a representitive republic but our needs are not being represented, the corporations are. This is why I'm in the occupy movement, to try and return to our constitution and excercise my rights. We want the government to represent us and not the corporations, they are not people. Everyone thinks we are there to get money from the 1%, while this may be true for many what I have just written is true for me and most in the movement.

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    Jan 23 2012: To think that the corporations run our govenment- think again. To think that we have a government-think again.

    You spend you money on stuff that supports corporations which then gives them the fuel they need to influence the false heart of humans-greed! Stop buying the stuff of corporations and you starve them of the very food that makes them grow big and strong. Start spending money on those things that creates health, liberty and happiness for all who are willing to participate in creating Heaven on Earth.

    We do not have a government because we the people of the USA are the government. Every complaint we have against government is a direct complaint against our self. Government is a reflexion of the people. We have a corrupt government as an expression of currupt people voting into office corrupt people. If you desire absolute democracy then you must Govern yourself and reject the temptations of your false heart-your greediness. SELF Governing is True Democracy. It requires SELF discipline in order to Self Govern and we must hold a vision of our future self in order to exercise our free will towards Self Government.

    How you live life and exprience love is your current expression of Heaven on Earth.
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      Jan 23 2012: Dan, although I take issue with your focus on greed, see:

      http://www.ted.com/conversations/8519/how_do_we_get_corporations_out.html?c=398180

      I do think you are right in pointing out the importance of our individual behaviour to our dilemma.

      I recently read an interesting statement - “we need to get beyond the belief in the idea that every human owning a car is a basic human right”. Something in that comment touches on an important issue to human progress. The idea of refocusing our priorities to the things which truly enhance our fulfillment. I don’t think that humankind lacks the material resources for all humans to live satisfying lives. But it is important that we make judicious use of the resources available to us.
      • Jan 24 2012: Ultimately, we all seem to agree that there are some fundamental problems but we seem to be arguing in different scales of the problems.

        You Tim and others are arguing that the details of the Constitution are being manipulated by government using policy and by corporation using finance. I am blending this entire conversation down into what I sense with that claim and am trying to say that your argument is; The devil is in the details of the systems of checks and balances.

        I and I think Dan and others would agree that the main problem with government and corporations is that the people who lead those entities, don't follow the behavior that the Preamble to the Constitution projects. Not the image that I have anyway. Furthermore, the people, who actually do have a voice, in both government and corporation at the cash register (not the voting booth), aren't exactly living the lifestyle that is implied in the Preamble either. That is essentially the mission statement of each individual and is each individuals responsibility, if they themselves desire freedom.

        In order for me to justify the freedom I have, I must insist that everyone is entitled to the same. Anyone being entitled to any more or less of anything is not in the spirit of equality. I consider a vast majority of the things we have in some way are harmful to other specific people on this planet. My desire for a coke is harmful to other people on this planet in some not so obvious ways but hang on, I've got a party coming up this weekend and guess what goes great with rum. When I behave in this manner, I consider that to be "greedy". Perhaps I could choose another word that is more suited to my beliefs but then again, that would just be semantics. I would still feel the same way just with a different vocabulary.

        This might be a good add to the conversation. If you make profit, how is that an equal trade? (this question is more at the root of the concept and not what happens in the market place.)
        • Jan 24 2012: Stephen
          A really good post. I think you are correct in your general description of people who have participated in this dialogue.

          I am not against profit or even people making money. My biggest concern is how that money is used. Is it used to exploit more people? Is it used to buy undo influence either in the marketplace or in Congress? Is it used to actually multiply the common good? See I believe there are companies who try to do that. They do make a buck, but somehow in all of that, the common good, more jobs, better products, a better world (at least materially) is out there. We don't live in a barter society, so attempting to say profit production is not an equal trade just doesn't make much sense. But again, what are corporations doing with their profits?

          In my own personal life I am coming to revalue some things: solitude and quiet, work that is fulfilling and makes me happy, a lifestyle that enjoys while not exploiting.

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