TED Conversations

Colin Erskine

This conversation is closed. Start a new conversation
or join one »

"Morality" is an abused term/concept. Can you suggest a solid definition?

We use the term "morality" so liberally across different conversations. Usually metaphorically without getting specific. It bothers me to no end when excellent speakers use the term "morality" loosely as if it necessarily implies specific behaviors like "sharing = moral" and "murder = immoral." To me, morality always seems best defined as sound reasoning and conclusion forming. Of course, as opposed to unsound reasoning.

It seems really clear that morality represents only that basic intention in any living creature to do something right as opposed to doing it erroneously. That is, it seems morality comes down to the intent of doing what seems to make the most sense to the best of the abilities of the individual or group of individuals.

As a simple anecdotal example, consider indulging a vice and stealing a purse from a store and then getting caught. While it may have seemed like a rational thing to do under the circumstances of expecting to get away with it, upon getting caught it would become apparent that the decision was not well calculated and certainly most harmful to the one person you were intending to take care of most, yourself. Your failure to achieve your own aim of self-enhancement is what dictates your actions as immoral, even from your own perspective.

Of course, there are a number of vices one might indulge that have negative consequences not only for the self but perhaps for society at large. Any action a ruler might take which brings about the unrest and revolt of her people, would be highly suspicious as being immoral since a ruler's decisions ought to be made to enhance their rule rather than degrade it.

Moral actions in all cases, seem to be those which the individual (and perhaps other individuals) can observe as clearly having the intended effect both in foresight as well as in hindsight. All other actions seem to neatly fit the description of immoral.

I'm interested in hearing other holistic, absolute definitions of the term "morality"

Related Talks:
Topics: Negative thinking Positive thinking critical thinking definition education morality rationality
+2
Share:

Showing single comment thread. View the full conversation.

  • Mark Meijer 100+

    • 0
    HostAssociate
    Nov 2 2011: If you're interested in holistic views of morality, stop trying to fit morality in to the framework of ego. It's not going to work.

    • Colin Erskine

      • 0
      Nov 2 2011: Mark Meijer, not sure what you're saying. It's not as though altruism is an achievable standard, technically speaking. I wouldn't ever neglect the role the ego plays in decision making. Without my ego being involved to at least a small extent, I don't think the behavior could be attributed to "me."

      • Mark Meijer 100+

        • 0
        HostAssociate
        Nov 2 2011: Correct, it can't be attributed to "me". Even if the ego claims ownership of decisions, this attribution is false. It always was. So the ego is "involved" only insofar as it is believed, taken at face value. Ego is just thoughts, even that claim of ownership of decisions is just a thought after the fact. Altruism is to stop believing you are those thoughts called ego. It's when the distinction between selfishness and selflessness is seen to be just as illusory as the ego itself. How would you know if that's not an achievable "standard", technically speaking?

        • Colin Erskine

          • 0
          Nov 3 2011: "Altruism is to stop believing you are those thoughts called ego." - Which is impossible. For example, I think chairs could be said to be appropriately altruistic but people who make chairs can't be.

          "How would you know if that's not an achievable "standard", technically speaking?" - It's impossible to be selfless unless you have no self. Everyone has a self, so selflessness is clearly impossible. That's the way I've seen things for years. Altruism is, it seems to me, an unattainable ideal.

      • Mark Meijer 100+

        • +1
        HostAssociate
        Nov 3 2011: Yes, it seems to you that altruism is an unattainable ideal. But do you know for sure? Maybe it only seems unattainable, because people insist on believing the thought which tells them that it seems unattainable, without being able to substantiate it. Will you stand for that? If someone else told you that you could not attain something you wanted, would you just take their word for it? Why hold the belief that it seems unattainable as true, without actually checking it out?

        You think you have a self, because you tend to take certain thoughts at face value, believing that is you. Don't you wonder, if "you" have a "self", then who is it that has this "self"? You have no problem disbelieving me, so what makes you think it's an unattainable ideal to disbelieve ego thoughts?

        You already sometimes disbelieve it, because that's the only reason you even know about the ego (which is what you call "your self"). Because you don't always listen to it unconditionally, right? And that's exactly why you are a moral person. Not because of the ego, but in spite of it. Because there is something underneath it which can choose to indulge it or not.

        That choice is available all the time, not only sometimes. All that is needed is seeing for yourself how this works, simply by checking it out in your own direct experience, sothat you can learn to consistently see those thoughts for what they are, as well as how the body responds to those thoughts. But not by adopting another belief, rather by finding out the truth about whatever belief you have now.

        You say everyone has a self? You say it's impossible to disbelieve ego thoughts? Prove it. Not to me. Just look at it, see if it's true. Find out where "your self" is. If ego is just a bunch of thoughts, how can it own anything, or do anything? How can those thoughts control you unless you listen to them without question? Don't theorize about it. Investigate it. It's not difficult. You'll be surprised.

Showing single comment thread. View the full conversation.