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Rafi Amin

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Where do we come from & where do we go ?

I wanted to know what is the answer to this question from science prospective although some religion has some how answer to this question (we are created by god & given the opportunity to do good & bad & finally rewards for our actions after death either paradise or hell).

I could not explain the question in an efficient way but I hope you got what I,m trying to know.

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  • Nov 1 2011: its not really scientific explanation: but i heard from a global heart.
    "We are like individual rain drops falling from the sky and returning to the ocean. We come from source, and to source we shall return- One and the same"(from a fb page:Project Earth)
    > no matter rain drop / ocean - everything is water and hence everyone is a fractal of source/GOD =)
    and yeah i hav a ques too, why do we come ?
    GOD Bless =)
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      Nov 1 2011: I do agree. We were all made of dust and will soon return into dust. We come from our Creator and go back again to our Creator in Heaven. Whether one believes in God or not, it's such a nonsense if we were born just as a body, where did our spirits come from?

      Remember, we are not human experiencing spirit but sipirit experiencing human form. ;-)
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        Nov 1 2011: "if we were born just as a body, where did our spirits come from?"

        Only those who believe in God or some sort of spiritual force more or less believe humans to have a spirit. So your question is loaded with an assumption that is not made by those who do not believe in God. There is as much evidence for a soul as there is for God, so one does not aid the existence of the other, since they are both entirely based on faith.
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          Nov 6 2011: Dear Matthieu,
          I do not agree with your statement..."only those who believe in God or some sort of spiritual force more or less believe humans to have a spirit".

          As I think you know by now, because of many conversations we've had, I do not believe in a god and I do believe that we are energy beings. In my perception, the words spirit, soul, god and energy can be easily exchanged. I do not believe I am going back to a "creator", and I do believe that the energy that flows through my body will move on to other forms. It has been scientifically proven that we have energy running through our body and mind, so this concept is NOT based entirely on faith, nor is it at all "loaded", unless one whats to percieve it in that light:>)
      • Nov 2 2011: " in Heaven. Whether one believes in God or not, it's such a nonsense if we were born just as a body, where did our spirits come from?"

        What is spirit and do you have a proof such a thing exists? Science still knows little about the brain and anything else is to the interpretation of individual.

        A few hundred years back it was a nonsense to think that people can fly. Now we all take it for granted. I think the same applies with brain and consciousness. We need to wait for science to give us answers or our civilization to reach technology that helps us to understand who we are and what our purpose (if any) is in this Universe?
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          Nov 2 2011: When are we going to realize that science is not the truth, but only attempts to discover the truth, it is only THE MIDDLE MAN. It is the TRANSLATOR. It looks at what exists, and attempts to translate it, explain it to humanity.
          Science (the translator) is fallible, falls short, is getting better each day, and more precise, but will always be the middle man.

          Science, told us longtime ago that the world was flat, that death was surely what you'd get once you reached the horizon. More recently, Einstein's relativity opened the door to a lot of answers, explained a lot of things. Today we know that, good as it is, it is not sufficient, and it doesn't explain some things it should. Science is looking yet at another frontier of knowledge.

          Science is getting better at translating, but will always try to just explain this amazing creation to us, created beings.
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          Nov 2 2011: I don't see why the fact that science is not the whole truth negates what Zdenek said. Regardless that it falls short sometimes, it's the most powerful tool for explaining our universe and what contains it.

          Science never said the Earth was flat, it was just popular belief. For science to say the Earth was flat would have required this conclusion to have come from the scientific methodology which it most certainly did not.I wish people would stop using this ridiculous argument which only shows ones scientific illiteracy.

          We've know that Einstein's theory of relativity doesn't cover everything for decades, we didn't just figure it out now. Quantum mechanics has existed for well over a decade and unification of the four forces has been at the center of much of the physics we have done for the pas decades.

          Faith, on the other hand, proves absolutely nothing. If you believe anything on faith alone, then criticizing science for not providing the ultimate truth is risible (no scientist claims that science has all the answers either. Mathematics have in fact clearly shown that some problems are unprovable [Halting problem]). If we're going to set the record straight on science, let's do it for faith. Faith is believing in things without evidence, good luck deriving truth from that.
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          Nov 3 2011: Matthieu, hi! I suspected you were going to jump in, good to talk with you.

          Briefly, to set the record straight:
          I didn't try to negate what Zdenek said, I built on it and went deeper and wider.

          Also, I don't appreciate the attitude. Not in the spirit of edification but rather elimination.

          As for the rest of your comment, I DO NOT criticize science for not providing the ultimate truth, I celebrate it for doing all it can today.

          Finally, I would never try to entangle faith and science, they cover entirely different territories; I recommend you not to go there -that would make you a Tom Cruise :-P
      • Nov 2 2011: Hi Karina, science does not necessarily gives us an absolute truth but just an approximation. We can accept its theories and findings as a temporary truth before better theories and facts are established.

        What most people don't realize is that science continues to improve our knowledge and understanding of the Universe. Lets assume that a few hundred years ago science told us Earth is flat. That is truth if you measure the flatness in a very small area of the Earth. However wiith better instruments scientists concluded that Earth is actually round.

        Similarly with Newton's laws, these laws accurately predict and explain movements of objects. However as science progressed scientists realized that the model is not accurate or valid in all scenarios. With larger objects and higher speeds Newton's laws stop being valid and instead quantum mechanics needs to be used. Again, scientists improve our understanding.

        It is to be expected that science continues to get closer and closer to the ultimate and absolute truth because our technology allow us to gain more data and make more observations about the Universe.

        I don't see why human brain and anything else should be excluded from this process? I also don't see why we could not eventually arrived at the absolute truth? cheers
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        Nov 7 2011: @Colleen: I understand, but surely you can conceed that Gloria's attempt at a reductio ad absurdum is misplaced given that the existence of a soul, whether it is more of a ghostlike self or pure energy, is only a hypothetical position. Whatever each of us believes, one cannot argue a flawed premise from a hypothetical conclusion. Correct?

        @Karina: Point taken, although apart from its name, scientology actually makes very few scientific claims. Deepak Chopra is a better example of someone who warps science to sell his brand of faith (cf quantum healing and other such nonsense).
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          Nov 7 2011: Hi Matthieu,
          I understand you as well, and I will conceed only that each and every one of us has a belief, based on information we have at any given time. Considering the topic of this discussion, I do not percieve Gloria's comments or beliefs to be "misplaced".
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        Nov 7 2011: @Colleen: Her belief no, the particular comment yes. You cannot reject a premise based on a hypothetical statement.

        A soul may or may not exist. The body may or may not be the only thing there is. But you cannot reject the latter with the former because they are both hypothetical. Let's turn the phrase the other way around, would you accept:

        "it's such a nonsense, where did our spirits come from if we are just a body?"

        Is this a valid objection? Of course not. It's also invalid. Even though a good case can be made for the materialist view, one cannot take it as a given to call the other position nonsense. This I object to. And I am surprised you cannot see why its objectionable.
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          Nov 7 2011: Matthieu,
          Technically, you may be correct, and if this were a test of some kind, one may say a "particular comment" is not appropriate because of technicalities.

          That being said, we are having a discussion on TED my friend. I don't see the question as an "objection", as you apparently do...I see it as simply a question. There are plenty of comments on TED that say one or the other perspective is "nonsense". If you want to "object" to the use of a word or phrase, that's ok...where does it take us in discussion? I just don't think it's anything to get your bloomers in a knot about...do you? :>) I also take into consideration that English is not everyone's first language.

          I agree with you... "A soul may or may not exist. The body may or may not be the only thing there is". I LOVE your comment to Rafi about life being made up of puzzle pieces, which we assemble:>)
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      Nov 2 2011: Hi Pradee,

      Thanks for your thoughts but I don't think people of this time will believe that we we were rain drops coming from sky & returning to the ocean.

      We have to find out what is that source that we come from ? who has made it ?
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        Nov 2 2011: God. *in my belief. And soon, I know that it will that of the world too.
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          Nov 2 2011: Gloria, I didnt get your point. Do you mean it is the god who has created all these ?
      • Nov 2 2011: Rafi and Pradee, we cannot expect science to ever answer such existential questions, science at this stage is still largely material, mass, velocity, spin, of individual particles of matter. Even our knowledge of energy so very incomplete. This larger question delves deeper into something that I believe is both. We are carbon based life forms. Our physiology is pretty well understood, other than brain and consciousness. I believe that there is matter always present in the universe, as is myriad forms of energy. But this creator we speak of is whatever force that so elegantly, combined the two into a self aware being with a planet and other life forms to learn from and survive from consuming to generate biological energy by way of metabolism. I believe there is a larger sea of energy, which mankind is not yet responsible enough to discover(for we would exploit). This sea of energy is where the soul comes from and where the energy that is the soul shall return when the material vessel, the body has reached it's end. We exist as souls, but to experience physical reality, we must exist in bodily form. I believe that from the hydrogen atom to the energy composing a human soul, Each electron, ion had to evolve electrically in complexity. And that the energy composing humans consciousness, is the most evolved, hence being self aware & entrusted with free will. It is an evolutionary process of the consciousness energy within us, as well as the evolution of the vessels to carry consciousness energy. Our bodies, science has proved, have evolved over eons. But I believe that so too has the energy we call souls, or consciousness. I believe the roots of this is evident in other cultures beliefs in reincarnation. Although they don't give mechanism. I believe we have climbed up a ladder of evolutionary rungs, given a chance at self awareness. Where our soul, is given the chance to actualize itself, in whatever way is befitting to the individuals energy. We are consciousness energy
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          Nov 5 2011: Though very late but,thanks for explanation. I got u.

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