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Matthieu Miossec

Doctoral Student - Genetic Medecine (Congenital Heart Disease),

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Our modern societies still need feminism

It is undeniable that the great feminist movements of the 20th century have come and gone and have left in their wake an impressive shift towards gender equality. But has it been enough? Are we really there yet or does the 21st century need to see more feminist movements in order to see gender equality become a tried and true facet of our societies.

Let's hear some arguments for or against the current proposition "Our modern societies still need feminism". Let's also hear arguments for what would and what wouldn't be appropriate for a 21st century feminism.

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Closing Statement from Matthieu Miossec

Whether we agree that our modern societies still need feminism or not, it is clear that the issue is still a hot topic. I greatly encourage everyone to read some of the exchanges of this debate, particularly those which include Andrea Grazzini Walstrom's insight.

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  • Jul 5 2011: I agree with much that has been said here. Feminism has brought about needed change and awareness to many injustices in our world. I am very encouraged when I now see that in many countries women are being liberated from their opressors.

    I think it is very important to note however that men are not the enemy here. It is an incorrect idealogy, and in some cases religion twisted for personal gain that is the problem. Along these lines, I believe that feminism was a byproduct of men who abused their God given responsibilities to protect and love selflessly. I think it can be easy to only focus on part of the issue with this topic, and it can become unbalanced. I would like to see more men act with integrity, honesty, and selflessness.
    • Eva M

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      Jul 9 2011: "feminism was a byproduct of men who abused their God given responsibilities to protect and love selflessly" I agree!

      The thing is, apart from some positive achievements – like enabling women to vote, learn, work and divorce abusive husbands – it all went WAY too far. Feminism is a self-righteous ideology of hatred against men, an ideology to justify egotistical “I am my own person, and I will be doing what I want, and when I want” kind of thinking.

      In the western world majority of women became demanding and bossy. Under their influence men became wimpy. This is what "the modern women" want - a man she can easily manipulate. Woman made so much harm to the picture of man. Woman are able to abuse men easily without any consequences. It is a popular view that men are pigs, wimps, clumsy idiots. For God’s sake! I go to work and I hear my colleague complaining about her boyfriend: “Again, he didn’t do that. Well, he is of men.” How abusive! And she is not alone in her opinion. But I beg to differ.

      Real men are worthy of great desire and big love! Girls, have you ever felt seen through by a man of character? A real man triggers in a woman the passions that are her very core of being, huge emotions, huge energy, madness, wilderness, life. And also, desire to serve and take care of all his needs, and give herself away completely. Men need to be loved and supported to be strong and ready to meet the needs of women. We don’t need feminism anymore, we need women to revise their picture of men and heal them, strengthen them, love them, and love them more.

      We don’t need more girls to be dry like sticks, lifeless and professional. We don’t need more men turning into housewives. We need real men and women. Yes, men with integrity, honesty and selflessness, and women willing to surrender, love and give themselves to men.

      Mutual love and service is what people miss. More love and care, and no more feminism, please.
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        • Eva M

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          Jul 10 2011: Thanks Jaime. I didn't expect to be applauded.

          I strongly believe that people should serve one another in all relationships, but I lose with the more popular approach to life: "I would rather rule in hell, than serve in heaven." Especially women react badly to the idea of serving men. This is FORBIDDEN to say. You will get eggs and tomatoes flying from both sides.

          The cold hell of power-tripping is up for grabs, if people like this perversion. I found freedom and happiness in love and service, so that is possible too. The choice is up to the people.
      • Jul 9 2011: Eva,

        "Yes, men with integrity, honesty and selflessness, and women willing to surrender, love and give themselves to men."

        As a man, I can tell you that I do not want a woman who will surrender to me. I want a woman who is my equal...A woman who can be my partner, not my property. If I am lucky enough to have a daughter, she will be raised knowing that she is to surrender to no man.

        Perpetuating the fallacy that man was created in God's image and should surrender to Him and that woman was created in man's image and therefore should surrender to him is to continue to teach a barbaric idea conceived in the dessert by MEN thousands of years ago. An idea that has far outlived its time.

        I don't agree with much of the feminist perspective. I feel that many statistics are quoted without much thought as to why the numbers are the way they are. There are logical answers to explain much of the disparity in employment figures between men and women in the Western societies. However, I do truly feel that woman's struggle to be accepted as man's equal is not over and should not end until the battle is won.

        "In the western world majority of women became demanding and bossy. Under their influence men became wimpy. "

        Can you show me some facts to back this claim up? Can you show how this is nothing more than an uneducated opinion?

        " Woman are able to abuse men easily without any consequences. It is a popular view that men are pigs, wimps, clumsy idiots"

        To your first point, I disagree. There are no consequences to abusing a man only if the man agrees for there to be no consequences. To your second point, I have to say that many men are pigs, wimps, clumsy idiots---just as many women are pigs, wimps, clumsy idiots. Let's not help the trend continue by teaching that women should surrender to men. Instead, let's stop teaching bigotry and intolerance. Let's stop teaching that any class of individual is below another.
        • Eva M

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          Jul 10 2011: As a woman I would not want to be seen as a property either. But surrendering is not making anyone into a property, and does not make anyone inferior. It is a freely given love. It needs to be accepted as such, and not abused.

          I am absolutely standing for partnership. I think that both genders are glorious in themselves and perceiving them as unequal is insane to start with. There is beauty and potential in both, and to discover what it is, people would need to be willing to step into the dynamics between the two, and not try to erase the differences.

          Any sane woman would not be willing to surrender to a man who does not see her as who she is, and just as an object of some sort. Surrendering in an oppressive relationship is not a good idea. I don't advertise it. God forbid!

          But without being able to surrender, a woman will not find her full potential AS HERSELF. She thrives in a relationship where she can give herself fully in love, let go of reservations and jump. She is strong there, and powerful, not a victim. It takes risk to do it. And that's why she needs a man who will catch her when she jumps.

          A woman needs a man to hold a moral standard in life. This is the strength in men that she is looking for. I am not talking about brute muscle power, I am talking about the strength of character, integrity. She must feel that a man would do right by her, who would hold her and love her, who would lead her in this tango called life. That's what I am talking about.
          I am talking of a life of mutual devotion, not mutual exploitation.
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        Jul 10 2011: To be honest Eva, I think that's a problem that stems from the still prevailing gender inequalities. It takes root in the idea that women even now still need to be taken care of (the assumption behind this being that Men need to be in charge). The pressures to conform to this are immense because everyone buys into it. Some of my friends have tried to shame me for the fact that I don't systematically pay for everything my girlfriend and I do together. They all pay for their girlfriends every single time they have meals or go to the movies, and to them it's the natural thing to do.

        Of course, it's too easy to think that this is the culmination of feminism because of the fact that it's the woman in the relationship that reaps the benefits, but if you think about it, the underlining principles behind that behaviour is clearly this pervasive notion that Men need to take care of their Women because they are the stronger sex. I wouldn't say people who partake in this behaviour aren't consciously sexist, just blissfully unaware that they're perpetuating it a sexist tradition.
        • Eva M

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          Jul 10 2011: I think that the problems stems from human selfishness and trying to reap the benefits from the other, and not do FOR the benefit of other.

          As you say, buying into social expectations is not the right thing to do. And we are all sensitive (both men and women) and KNOW when someone uses her/his position wrongly.

          There is a way in which a woman needs to be taken care of, but if she perceives herself as a weak and needy to get that care out of a man - (gimme that!) - that is WRONG. And what she really needs then is that she needs to get straight.
          By the way, there is also a way a man needs to be taken care of. And also men sometimes misuse this sound expectation, and tend to treat women as the tools for filling those needs, forgetting to notice the person.

          This is selfishness what is screwing things up, not the nature of the genders. Genders as themselves, and people as themselves are good and equal and nothing can change it. Genders and people can be misunderstood, misused, abused, but their fundamental quality and equality, even if suppressed, will not change.
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      Jul 10 2011: Yes, well I think we can agree that at the root of many problems lies our human selfishness.

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