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S. Ahmadi

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A TASTE of IRAN

talks there are a familiar thread “stand in their shoes; develop empathy; waging war when we don’t understand; peace and war, etc.”

All Iranians are invited with all kinds of mind (opened, closed, semi-opened)
All non-Iranians interested to know Iran as it is in real are Invited.

Let’s take up the challenge and make a joint effort to learn more about Iran.

this topic is made as a part of the series of ""A TASTE" SERIES: to explore the countries and cultures of those in conflict!" by recommendation of Dear friend Wongmo R.

http://www.ted.com/conversations/3131/a_taste_series_to_explore_t.html


please ask your questions about Iran.
other Iranians please participate.

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    Jun 8 2011: Hi S.R.thanks for openning this thread.
    I have a question for you
    1)what Iranians care most about?
    2)what dose the local news say about other nations(i mean their attitude)
    • Jun 8 2011: Hi Amily,
      "1)what Iranians care most about?"
      this is a general question. which part of Iranians you mean? please clarify.
      but a general reply:
      near 90% of Iranians are Shia and the majority of Iranians are believers Shia but with different level of believe and care about religious (Shia) concerns. although lots of people do not care about religious concerns.
      but who care about religion (Shia) are who made revolution and have near 1 million martyr in imposed iran-Iraq war and I think the most thing they care is their revolution and in fact Shi Islam. they are ready to be killed by Shia be survived and protected. the best example is:
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_Revolution
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran–Iraq_War
      when Imam Khomeini said we need soldier most of people including childs, women did their best to Iran does not lose even one square meter of land to Iraq and although world supported Iraq Iran won the war.
      this group are not in from and in media always but if the feel revolution is in danger take action. for example last year they showed a waring against green movement in Iran:
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911221118
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911221117
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911221101
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911221089
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911221061
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911221052
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220970
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220939
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220940
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220871
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220819
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220761
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220729
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220670
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220638
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220316
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220539
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220334
      • sha b

        • +2
        Jun 8 2011: "but who care about religion (Shia) are who made revolution"

        I know you are not the kind of person(like some people I know) who would lie out right, It's not your fault that in Iran flow of information is controlled.

        But did you honestly forget the leftist groups role in Iran's revolution? What about Cherikhaye fadai khalgh? Khate 3 ha? Toodei ha? Razmandegan e khalgh? Did they stand and fight with Shah and his people along side religious people or not?

        And I am not even going to get into a debate about the green movement, I don't think I can be cool headed enough, "Showed a warning to us"...by killing and torturing our people"?, because they have an army to defend them and we don't? And you care for Palestinians but not us?...I'd say At least Palestinians have armed forces.

        Just like how Palestine was their land, This is ours. What are we to do? Follow the Supreme leader or follow the exist sign?
        • Jun 9 2011: "in Iran flow of information is controlled."
          recently most people have Internet or satellite TV and easily are connected to any channel or website they want. and who have not Internet or satellite get information from their friends of families who has. I disagree now information is controlled.
          but about governmental TV channels and official channels and about newspapers I agree they are controlled and anything is not allowed to be published. but people have no problem in getting any kind of information they want using Internet and satellite.
          although satellite is officially restricted in Iran but the number of people using it is so much that government has understood can not control it and in real it is free.
          many roofs in Tehran is like this:
          http://www.alborznews.net/files/fa/news/1389/4/13/12918_844.jpg

          also Internet is restricted officially and some pages does not open and show a governmental message that this link is banned. but near all people know how to circle it easily using many proxy software and websites. also US supports producing software for it. US has some annual budgets for developing democracy in Iran through different anti-Iranian groups. and in real people have access to any website and government know this.

          "What about Cherikhaye fadai khalgh? Khate 3 ha? Toodei ha? Razmandegan e khalgh? ... "
          I am born 3 years after revolution and I do not know them well. let me study and write about each of them later. but generally I know they had conflict with revolution. but revolution was mostly by religious people and also some groups was helping resolution for gaining some advantages after revolution. not really for Khomeini and religious purposes.

          by warning I mean the large parade I had its pics above (lots of farsnews links) not killing. what killing you mean? be clear.
          by us who you mean?
          about green movement I agreed their critics to government at start stages. but then it was abused by US, EU against Iran by propaganda.
          what is exist sign?
        • Jun 11 2011: In answer to "Ahmadi"
          "most people have Internet or satellite TV and easily are connected to any channel or website they want"

          Are you kidding? Who can view any channel or website he wants in Iran? Of course they can if they know how to hack through the filter walls of the Islamic Republic.

          And this is what happens to satellite TV dishes:
          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1v0zHDdhCY

          And this is what will happen if they protest for their obvious rights:
          http://www.iranhumanrights.org/2011/06/rape-and-torture-video-testimony/

          Please don't tell me this is not true. If it was only from one or two or event ten victims, I would believe you but when there are hundreds of rape victims, no one can deny it.
        • Jun 12 2011: "Of course they can if they know how to hack through the filter walls of the Islamic Republic."
          as I see most people using internet know how to hack it. it is peace of cake.

          "And this is what happens to satellite TV dishes"
          yes. but this is very few and only some times in past years. comparing people using it and government has knew this method has no effect and I header the parliament has a plan to make satellite TV free legally.
          it is enough you go to roof of a home in Tehran and look. most roofs are full of dishes.
          I do not want to validate any behavior of government but realty is that any one who wants to have TV dish can have it easily.

          "Please don't tell me this is not true. "
          I do not tell. such things exist.

          "I would believe you"
          what you mean? what I said that you believe?

          "but when there are hundreds of rape victims"
          I do not know exact but I do not think hundreds.
          some cases happen illegally by soldiers or guards or officials of prisons. and this is ugly behavior.

          do you think I validate all behaviors happen in Iran?

          also there is no positive aspect in Iran? you only see problems?
        • Jun 13 2011: "also there is no positive aspect in Iran? you only see problems?"

          You start a debate with the subject TASTE of IRAN, and then you start advertising your political and religious views??

          I see all the beauty of Iran and I'll fight for making Iran beautiful again. And yes, there is no positive aspect about the ruling system of Iran.
        • Jun 14 2011: Dear Naiem Yeganeh
          "You start a debate with the subject TASTE of IRAN"
          actually I did not want to start this topic. some TED member wanted me to start this topic and I predicted such conflicts with other Iranians and I did not like this. but after days I felt if I do not this maybe misinterpreted and I do not like to reject any request from any human unless it has conflict with satisfaction of Allah. so I started this topic.

          "and then you start advertising your political and religious views??"
          I only replied questions. you can reply also. also TED is for spreading ideas.

          "I see all the beauty of Iran and I'll fight for making Iran beautiful again"
          also me. please do not think I am satisfied with government of Iran.
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          Jun 14 2011: What SR says is true. We encouraged him to share Iranian culture and he graciously started this thread for which I am very grateful. I have learned a lot.
        • Jun 15 2011: thanks Debra Smith,
          actually i am not fan of Iran government.
          Iran has two main part:
          1- Original Islamic republic by Khomeini
          2- government of Iran with many problems like blackmail, unemployment, inflammation in prices, high costs of living, not respecting people, ugly behaviors to people and many more problems.

          if you see I am a fan of Iran it does not mean I am fan of any ugly behavior of Iran government.
          but I love to all problems be solved and we have a brilliant Iran in world. but also some people (minority) basically are anti Islamic revolution according to their anti Islamic beliefs. I am not from them. I am fan of Khomeini and Islamic revolution and I want to Iran government correct itself.
          because of Iran revolution and Iran Iraq war (imposed to Iran and supported by US and Canada and nearly all countries) I think the process of development in Iran backed to past 100 years. that war was like crusade for development of Europe.
          actually today Iran is like the Europe after the crusade war.
          today West has at least 100 years of development. but Iran is still repairing destroys of war.
          also please note that Iran is under sanction of All the world and can not have business and economic relations with world. Iran is like an Island in economic view with not growth.
          the only good aspect of Iran economy is Oil that helps economy.

          did you know Canada gifted the largest artillery made in history to Iraq during Iran Iraq war to Iraq kill more and more Iranian Muslim?
          and US every day send the best exact satellite photos of Iranian soldiers to Iraq to Iraq exactly know what Iranian soldiers are doing every day? while Iranians has no access to satellite? and many many more support of world to Iraq.
          near one million Iranians were killed in that war and many cities and factories and plants destroyed.
          although I do not validate any behavior of Iran government but at least I ask people do not see only bad aspects of Iran and see all aspects together.
      • Jun 8 2011: Hello SR. We are one world, one race. The human race. All these beliefs and all these laws that seperate one man from another are for those who have stopped thinking and dispute this. Whether we like it or not, we are all related and should treat one another as such.
        • Jun 9 2011: Dear Derek Payne,
          agree.
          but I personally believe peace is not possible completely in world.
          this is nature of world. as the blue color is nature of sky.
        • sha b

          • +2
          Jun 9 2011: Debra:
          Thanks, I wish more Iranian would show up, Trust me, Iran is not this boring.

          wongmo:
          Good idea. We don't know where are you from yet?

          Seyed Reza? Ahmadi :

          I am relived that at least you have critics about the government. And that you are honest.

          I think you took my propaganda bit wrongly(my bad English is at fault probably)
          I meant I don't need to hear you repeat what you have been feed which you think are your own thoughts.
        • Jun 10 2011: Dear sha b,
          I am Seyed Ruhollah Ahmadi.
          thanks. my evils are more than my goods.
          sorry for my misunderstanding.
          also I am not interested to hear what you have been feed by CNN,BBC,VOA and so on which you think are your own thoughts.
        • sha b

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          Jun 11 2011: Dear Tony,
          I think you are equating Arabs with Muslims, S.R Ahmadi is Muslim, But not Arab, He lives in Iran and in Iran Muslims aren't in minority, So he has yet to find out what is it like to be discriminated , Still I know what you mean, As long as it is about Islam, I understand where he is coming from, He can talk about it as much as he wants to, see if I step in and argue about "my" ideas, But when he is talking about Iran and the green movement and Iran's opposition in the past and present. I can't sit down and watch, I am passionate about that...Imagine someone who has seen her babies die, Can you argue with her that her babies weren't killed off?
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          Jun 12 2011: Sha B,

          I corrected my arrogant assumption somewhere below. I did not look at his profile, and very rarely do I look at user's profiles. I wrongly assumed he was an Arab. I do not recall him stating he was Iranian(but I've been on TED's discussion for very little), since many non-Iranians and even non-Muslims tend to step in against the increasing anti-Iranian propaganda of the last few years. I wasn't referring to the 'green movement', however.

          "Imagine someone who has seen her babies die, Can you argue with her that her babies weren't killed off?"

          I'm not sure why you would ask me such a question tho'.
        • sha b

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          Jun 12 2011: Tony,
          You said he is minority, And we should let him talk, I was saying I have no problem with him expressing himself, when he is talking about Islam, But when he is "expressing himself" is in "I have no idea why some people are opposing Iran's oh so innocence government", don't expect me not to step in. Being pro-Iran is something, being pro-Iran's government is another.
        • sha b

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          Jun 12 2011: Debra: Your very welcome.

          wongmo: ozzie? It sounds just as cute as Kiwi

          Well, about political rape, I have heard of people gathering info about that here and there, One of my friend once told me someone has asked him(he is a doctor) for advise about her son's condition who has been recently out of jail. I don't know any details, He said the guy doesn't communicate with other people anymore and sleeps beside his mother now, even thought he is twenty something.

          In any case, raping political prisoners is a way for disgracing them, I presume just like it is in any other country.
          And to that I should add there is another factor too, Some of the basijis I have noticed had been kept out of touch with normal families and normal life, I have seen them cussing people that are passing by with a very graphical bad language, They are known to be "that way". A way which I can't put in words. It's something un-describable.
          But if you ever interact with them, you would notice that._I guess I didn't give a personal summary or data after all-
      • sha b

        • +2
        Jun 9 2011: "people have Internet or satellite TV"

        Last time I checked satellite was illegal in Iran, and the Internet? 98% of the sites are banned for us. How long has it been since you have been here?

        And I am passed the stage of being argued with over the green movement and people who were killed during that crisis. I have witnessed more than my fair share of that one.

        And I couldn't care less what America, Americans Israel or who ever else that isn't here says. I know for a fact that even their most informed middle east and Iran experts know exactly nothing about the real world that I and my people are living in. Where were you when an armed Lebanese guard was shutting at my mother in Arabic, and threatening her with his gun in the middle of the city, in "our country"?

        In any case, I am definitely NOT the right target for your propaganda, I have seen too much to be argued with.

        Oh, And I don't think this is a wise move, even for me. You can be my next interrogator for all I know. So I am not going to anger you anymore.
        • Jun 9 2011: Dear sha b,
          "Last time I checked satellite was illegal in Iran"
          yes it is illegal formally but in real world many people are using it and it is impossible for government to control it and government has accepted this and there is some suggestions to it become free.

          "98% of the sites are banned for us."
          how you calculated this 98%?
          most people know how to circle it. also it has some good aspects. do you like porno websites be open in front of your child? my 3 years old daughter every day uses computer, installs games and download games from internet and use computer perfect. she made my laptop for herself and forced me buy another.

          "How long has it been since you have been here? "
          where? Iran? all my life. (30 years)

          "Where where you when an armed Lebanese guard was shutting at my mother in Arabic,"
          at the most of green parades i was at Enghelab square, Tehran and I was looking what you say. but this is normal in such conditions. no pain no gain. please compare it with the behavior of police in other countries:
          http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-06-05/israel-fires-on-protesters-at-golan-border-killing-three-syrian-tv-says.html
          which is better?
          any thing has its price.

          I am not police of any kind of governmental employee (only some part time teaching in university without employment) and I am not interested to interrogate any one. please do not prejudice about me. I am not a fan of any behavior of government. but I am fan of Koran and prophet and Imam Khomeini and I have many critics about government. any one is free to have his own think.
          also about propaganda I do not know what you mean.other people asked me to i start this topic and I am only replying questions in my opinions. you are also free to reply by your opinions and people are free to decide. please speak based on evidences. for example about 98% websites. usually propaganda is for a large audience of people. can you find more than 20 person in TED conversations? this is not right place for propaganda.
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          Jun 9 2011: Just want to second Wongmo's sentiments about being thrilled to see Sha b here.
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          Jun 10 2011: Salaam sha b,

          I just want to point out, in defense of S.R. Ahmadi, that sometimes he is a bit on the defensive, which may lead to an offensive tone. I am not in total agreement with Mr. Ahmadi(sometimes not at all), but I have noticed, in other topics, that he is one of the few Arabs expressing himself here, perhaps the "one against a million" that has to debate against people who have a distorted view on Islam and the Arab world. While some users wrap their diminishing comments towards Islam in politically correct sentences, I feel compelled to give him the credit that is due to him.

          I'm glad you will bring an interesting, insider's point of view to this forum.

          Khodaa fez!
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          Jun 10 2011: Tony: I believe S.R.Ahmadi is Persian, not Arab.

          Agree his perspective is important to the conversation.
        • Jun 11 2011: @Tony By using persian greetings I get the impression that you know the difference between Persians and Arabs, but by calling Mr. Ahmadi "Arab", I believe you have been tactfully sarcastic.
          Nice work mate.
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          Jun 12 2011: Actually, I have just massively failed to even bother looking at S.R Ahmadi's profile and took for granted that he was an Arab. I doubt he would take this as an offense. Never the less, I have to apologize.
          Standing corrected on Mr. Ahmadi's cultural background, I think the content of my comment remains valid.
        • Jun 12 2011: Dear Tony Sanchez,
          no problem. please take it easy.
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          Jun 12 2011: I take it so easily that sometimes I even let go ;)
      • sha b

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        Jun 11 2011: wongmo : Hey, I love your country too.

        S.R. Ahmadi :I don't watch CNN,BBC,VOA, we don't even have satellite, Nobody in our family is the TV watching type. Well I am more of a DVD watching person, and my ideas shaped way before DVDs and CDs, Back then, I only watched Iran's state TV's programs for kids like Kola Ghermezi and Pesarkhaleh, and Khooneye Madar Bozorge. So it must be it.
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          Jun 13 2011: Sha b, SR and Naiem (and everyond else)

          I have a question for you. On another TED thread people are defiining freedom. I am wondering whether or not you define freedom as an inner state or perspective or whether it has more to do with physical rights and lack of hinderances.
          I ask because I am seeking the perspective of people who are living with restricted freedoms and wondering if 'inner freedom' is enough.
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          Jun 13 2011: Tell me what "inner freedom" works for person in prison or about to be executed?
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          Jun 13 2011: Richard, I need an antidote to the koolaid on offer at the other thread. I thought that getting the perspectives of people in a different society might help me judge my own stance on the issue.
        • Jun 13 2011: @Debra, in my view freedom is a subjective matter. It should be judged based on human rights charter as minimum.
          Freedom only makes sense in the context of society. As human being forms societies it restrict itself in favour of safety and economy. Restrictions go far, then freedom comes to rescue.
          Since freedom makes sense only in the context of society, freedom being a state of mind is counter-intuitive.
          In my opinion freedom is consisted of social freedom (what to wear, where to go, who to pray, etc.) and freedom of speech (criticize anybody, anything etc.)
          If you question what are the degree of it, I would say it depends to the society, however there should be some minimum for it as human rights charter is a good guide.
          If in Australia I be baned from going to shops top less (as a man) I would feel my freedom is violated, but I wouldn't expect that in Iran. But if I am forced to wear hijab or not to wear hijab (this is a minimum accepted for a human being) regardless of the society I am living in, my freedom is violated and doest matter it is Iran or France. Freedom of speech etc. is more obvious.
          I believe freedom is a part of a bigger whole: freedom+human rights+democracy
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          Jun 13 2011: Naiem, Thank you so much for taking the time to share your thoughts with me.

          I hope you will not mind but I thought your words should be read and felt by more people and that they were very important. I cut and pasted your answer and put it one the 'What is freedom' thread. I hope that is acceptable. I could not wait for your permission as the thread is closing in the next couple of hours and I think you might be asleep.

          If for any reason you are not pleased by this -just let me know and I will remove it immediately. Thanks so much.
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          Jun 13 2011: But you havent answered my question
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          Jun 14 2011: I'm sorry Richard, after my torrent of words on the other thread I thought your question was rhetorical. The song of the caged bird is never as sweet and birds with their wings clipped do not fly - they have been denied the essential thing of being a bird.

          Perhaps the 'innies' as I have begun to think of them have one small point. People who can marshal their inner lives to occupy themselves (thinking of ways to escape or focussing like women do in labour)might make their situation a bit better for themselves- but this even sounds lame in my own ears.Nope- I'm definately a freedom is freedom kinda girl. I think it is almost dangerous to see how many people are willing to intellectually move to that 4 x4 cubicle.
        • Jun 14 2011: Dear Debra Smith,
          I left my comment there about freedom. did not see it?
          also about Hijab in Iran please also ask the opinion of some Muslim girls in Iran. the opinion of one person can not be a correct indicator of the opinion of all girls of Iran. many girls in Iran even haven no computer or even have no internet.
          if we assume 50% of Iran are female then there is 40,000,000 female in Iran. I do not think 1 sample out of 40,000,000 female in Iran leads to a correct Image about Hijab in Iran.
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          Jun 14 2011: Dear SR, I do not remember seeing your comment but thanks for reminding me. I will go back there to read your opinion. I did, however, view the documentary that was posted here of the Iranian family that I enjoyed and their perspective about the hijab was a good part of the film so I think I have a sense of how many women feel about it there.
      • sha b

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        Jun 12 2011: wongmo: No, Never been outside the boarders actually, Do you call your natives Kiwies?

        I can't see any of the links he -going by the name, it's a him- posted, a message shows up that they are inappropriate and against Iran's law.You mean he is alike to me in contrast to Mr Ahmadi? I think it's not about the point of view, it's a matter of being brain washed or not.(No offense Mr Ahmadi but I am being brutally honest) I can tell where is Mr Yeganeh coming from, I know people like him, But "alike"?...Hardly.

        There this site called old pictures(of Iran):
        http://runykey.blogfa.com/

        Working time routine in general(for non governmental work places):
        is from 8 to 17, from Saturday to Wednesday
        8 to 12 on Thursdays
        and Fridays are holidays

        for governmental work places :
        from 8 to 14 from Saturday to Wednesday
        and Thursday and Fridays are holidays

        Offices have a day break for lunch and prayers.

        In most non-governmental offices I have worked with women can put their headscarf aside if they want to_as long as it's not the kind of work that visitors from outside come in all the time, like you can't do that if you work in a Pharmacy_.

        Education is a very important aspect of our lives, It's very important that you at lease have a B.S on something to find a job or to marry. People with higher degrees and better universities are more respected.

        And family, from the day a child is born till s/he is dead or even after one is dead, family is everything for us.
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          Jun 12 2011: Thank you. I really enjoyed the pictures but it is your words that accompany them that mean the most.
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          Jun 13 2011: Hi wongmo r nice to learn you are an australian. I read your exchanges with Poby and always thought you were an Indian. Are you originally from India? Where did you live in Australia? And what took you to Iran?

          PS Sha b those are amazing pictures. I like that girl in the swimming suit. Are you wearing bikinis today? Just kidding :)

          PPS Naiem Yeganeh is also an Australian from Iran. Did you say you dont agree with him Sha b?
        • Jun 17 2011: @Richard
          I am not an Australian from Iran. I am an Iranian from Australia!
    • Jun 8 2011: http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220334
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220312
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220311
      http://www.farsnews.net/imgrep.php?nn=8911220221

      international media supported green movement in Iran and made it bigger than it was in real.
      but this not mean I disagree all aspects of green movement.
      Iran government needs critics to correct itself but the green movement was supported and abused in favor of policies of some countries like US. but in general I am supporter of critics in order to developing and correcting government.

      about non-religious or low level of believe people they care about usual thing like money, country, Persia, business,....

      "2)what dose the local news say about other nations(i mean their attitude) "
      they are not all the same. many different local news by different views are working. but generally they are two main category:
      1- who are supporters of revolution and Imam Khomeini views (Shia)
      2- who are supporters of west

      the 1 their attitude is carrying out views of Imam Khomeini and protecting revolution against west and say US and Israel are planning to destroy Iran and back it to pre-revolution status.

      the 2 their attitude is talk with west and negotiate and ending sanctions against Iran and having international relations and trade with west without conflict.

      but the majority and power is by group 1
      most are in Persian language.
      if you want to check from group 1 some samples are www.presstv.ir and www.farsnews.com
      and for group 2 usually they say same as what BBC and CNN say and sample is www.voanews.com/persian/news/ and www.bbc.co.uk/persian/ or www.balatarin.com
      because usually group 2 are restricted officially in Iran they are mostly in Internet.

      if you want to understand why Iranian people are ready to be killed for Shia Islam you should know "Husayn ibn Ali" and Karbala well:
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Karbala
      http://www.al-islam.org/short/karbala.
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        Jun 8 2011: thanks for your time ! so much to go thru.
        • Jun 13 2011: Amily, propaganda in Iran follows simple rules:
          1- Iran is has the best economy in the world. Is safest and improving sharply in science and technology.
          2- All western countries are in deep Sh*@#. In France people are protesting against gov everyday and Europe is eagerly turning to Islam.
          3- Every Iranian supports regime. A tiny population oppose it which are paid from CIA and Mossad and are agents of USA and Israel.
          4- America is going to be vanished from economical and social problems in close future.
          5- Western culture is broke. Girls get pregnant at 13 and families are fragile.
          6- Everything Iranian (all the old traditions, nationalist poets, etc) is bad and harmful to the society and anything Islamic is great and scientifically proven.
        • Jun 14 2011: Dear Naiem Yeganeh,
          I agree you about this rules. but I think you are some overstatementing.
          people are not donkey to believe anything. and also government is not donkey.
        • Jun 17 2011: You are right mate. People are not mules, and that is why the propaganda doesn't work and after 30 years of propaganda, youth that have not seen anything else except these propaganda when they were growing up, formed the green movement.
      • Jun 11 2011: Seyed,
        You are sending links from the most unreliable source in the journalism history. Fars news (famous as False News among Iranians) is the hardcore state's propaganda website. It is indeed the Goebbels website for Iran.
        • Jun 12 2011: "famous as False News among Iranians"
          I disagree. this is your opinion. among which type of Iranians?
          also it is pics. how pic can be false? you mean they are made by Photoshop?
          the parade of 22 bahman at last year was very huge in response of "green movement". to you disagree that huge parade all over Iran?
          I did not show text from it. they are pics. also the pics of 22 bahman are available in other websites. but I preferred its pics because they were made as gallery.
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          Jun 13 2011: Hi Naiem thanks for the previous post pointing out the 'UNRELIABLE SORCE" .it would be interesting to see how propaganda look like in Iran too;P or more procisely , i cant judge at all.

          and from above posts i am really curious that how do you Naiem and S.R make sure the source you check upon or the stand you take is objective=D?
        • sha b

          • 0
          Jun 13 2011: Hi Amily,
          On Farsnews: It's not just Naim, Even conservative pro government people would admit it. I'll just say it had became a laughing stock for us. It has an English section, And no surprised there that it is not the translation of Farsi version, Clearly the intended audiences differ.

          I won't link to them, Just open the Persian version and translate any random page you like by google translate, The most hilarious ones are in the culture section(فرهنگی)...you might get an idea .
        • thumb
          Jun 14 2011: Naiem and Sha b ,thanks for your relies and that helped me to have better understanding:)also how did you guys realise it is propogada?
        • Jun 14 2011: Dear sha b,
          about farsnews please note I showed photos not text.
          you mean photos are not real?
          all the Iran had a huge participate in that parade.
          I do not say anything in farsnews is lie but you are overestimating or brainwashed about it. can you show me some of the problems of that with evidence?
          I do not mean I am a fan of farsnews. but can you show some evidence about your opinion about farsnews?
          also please note it is not a govermental website.
          I only see you are insisting farsnews is bad and people should not look it.
          but even if farsnews is a liar the pics is speaking clear.
          do you claim those pics are made by photoshop?
          can you say what are those people are saying?
          please open your eyes and see some other people and do not think all people in iran think same as you. also I do not say all people are thinking as people in those pics.
          all kind of people are living in Iran. by I personally think people in those pics (fans of revolution) are the majority of Iran but they have not the power of controlling western media and they are always censored in western media but western media is escalating the minority of anti-revolution minority of Iran and so people of world even Iranians watching satellite TV think they are majority. even those minority themselves think they are much bigger then what they are really.
          please note what I say does not mean I am fan of every behavior of government I am fan of some and also I have critique to many (or most) behaviors and decisions and mistakes of Iran government. also many of people in those pics of 22 bahman parade.
          I only want to say please do not try to show something bigger than it is in real.
        • sha b

          • 0
          Jun 14 2011: Dear Amily:
          "how did you guys realized it is propaganda" Ok, Looks like I'll have to give you an exact example here, Ill just give you the first one I see:
          (thought cause I am worried they could track my IP address I still can't link to them here)
          There is this one about how Indian and native American spiritualism books had been scheduled to be translated and published in Iran by English Freemasons and Israeli Marxists, They have named a few examples like Paulo Coelho, Osho, Castaneda who have been published during the time Mr. Khatami(the reformist president that fundamentalists hate)was Iran's president to advertise transmogrification and Israelism. There is some mention of tsm movement and another Cabalist leader who is leading a universal group.
          There is too much shit in there and I know you are having a hard time believing me,

          This is some extracts of the text :

          چرا و چگونه است كه از كنار تفكرات اسرائيلي و تناسخ زاي برخي از نويسندگان اين كتابها كه اتفاقاً سابقه ماركسيستي هم در پرونده آنها موجود مي باشد، افرادي با سابقه گروهكي همچون جمشيد حاج اشرفي رهبر كاباليستي جريان خرافي tsm در ايران بوجود مي آيد و يا سركرده فرقه كيهاني به نام طاهري - كه هفته گذشته به جرم ارتداد و سب النبي بازداشت شد - به روش هاي خرافي جن گيري و پاكسازي روح و جسم انسانها از ويروس هاي غير ارگانيك(اشرار جني)، شكل مي گيرد و يا ايمان فتاحي به عنوان آواتار(خداي مجسم) به علوم باطني دست مي يابد و مدعي مي
        • sha b

          • 0
          Jun 14 2011: There is more :
          بايد پرسيد چرا و به چه دليل اجازه داده شد كتابهاي عرفانهاي هندي و سرخپوستي نظير "اوشو، كاستاندا، پائولو كوئيلو " و ... در ايران ترجمه و منتشر شود و آيا تجديد چاپ برخي از اين كتابها كه به 30 تا 50 بار رسيده بدون هيچگونه طراحي و برنامه ريزي بوده؟ آيا آموزه هاي شبه عرفاني و خرافي "كاستاندا " و يا آموزههاي غيراخلاقي و عرفان نماي "پائولو كوئيلو " حاصلي غير از فضاي موجود داشت؟ آيا "كوئيلو " در كتاب "كيمياگر " چيزي غير از خرافات را در اذهان مردم جهان جايگزين مي كند؟ زبان كيهاني كه در اين داستان به آن اشاره مي شود و مردم تشويق مي شوند اين زبان را فراگيرند تا بتوانند با آب و باد و خاك و گوسفند و ... به گفتگو بنشينند، غير از ترويج اين تفكرات است؟
          د.

          If you want to check:
          It's field under گروه فضاي مجازي / حوزه ساير حوزه ها (the cyber space group)-dated 90/02/25( one month before today) You can find it in the archive,( have fun browsing in the archive you'll find more like this in a blink of an eye)

          And if that isn't propaganda, I don't know what is.
        • sha b

          • +1
          Jun 14 2011: Dear SR,

          Yes I know, I noticed that, I also mentioned that even pro-government people( I am not even gonna say if I know you are one or not, pro-Islamic republic and pro-Khomeni: yes, I have figured) agree on Farsnews being a propaganda machine, It's not credible, maybe people here don't know but we all know they tend to publish and delete some news, and then deny it, or edit it, and also there have been cases of Photoshop in their history too), I didn't say this pictures are Photoshoped, I saw myself people going there in 22 Bahman.

          Some people go to 22Bahman , some people go to 25 Khordad, and some people just don't go anywhere, We are all Iranians. And don't worry, someday everybody will know everything, (Why are you worried? As it is, the ones who should be worried is us, Not you, You are living in an utopia you like. It's us who are being drilled with things we couldn't help but put up with-and I am pretty sure you know I am not talking about hijab or music or boyfriends/girlfriends or party or drinking or things like that Naim mentioned is some people's problems )
        • Jun 15 2011: Dear sha b,
          actually I do not know farseeing at all. but seems they are Islamic. but i do not think it is propaganda.

          about books you say I do not know how they show they are propaganda?
          some people are publishing books about Satanism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanism)
          I myself saw such books published in Iran in the latest International book fair in Tehran. and Iran government has banned publish of such books in Iran. and that news is about that such books are still being published even after being banned.
          I do not understand how this news is propaganda? what you mean exact?

          I again say:
          I DO NOT KNOW FARSNEWS
          I only searched for pics of 22 bahman parade and I found that website covering it by photo well. but not other websites. and I did not show you text from that website. text is possible to be propaganda but what about pic?

          "and also there have been cases of Photoshop in their history too"
          please show some as evidence.

          I did not want to say here. but I have seen many cases of photoshop edits in pics of green movement that they changed the pics of fans of revolution into green color.

          "Some people go to 22Bahman , some people go to 25 Khordad"
          I agree. but I believe international media like specially BBC and also CNN, foxnews and near all always try to overestimate green movement and show 22bahman small and even do not show it.
          it is clear when a country makes business sanctions against Iran extra than rules of UN and supports Israel its clear that his media will not show truth about Iran.
          also please accept the International media are biased about Iran.

          "someday everybody will know everything,"
          right now people know every thing. it is enough some thing happen in Iran and Persian BBC immediately announce it with overestimating. for example what people do not know?

          I am not worried. why you think I am worried.
          I have no doubt Iran revolution will not destroyed. but movements like green helps correcting government but can not destroy it.
        • Jun 15 2011: "Why are you worried? As it is, the ones who should be worried is us, Not you,"
          I am very worried about problems in Iran government. But I did not wrote them here.
          First we should know truth about Iran and past of iran and Iran iraq war and sanctions and all restrictions of world against iran and then start to critic Iran. When I see all the background and past of revolution history and restrictions of world to iran is not seen and only problems are seen I tried to first people know some background and real situation then seeing problems.
          It is like your child has done a bad doing and you punish him before hearing to his explains.

          "You are living in an utopia you like."
          Please do not prejudice. I am aware of benefits and problems of Iran. I am not satisfied at all from Iran condition. I prefer to leave Iran rather than staying Iran. But I love Khomeini and prefer to correct iran rather than destroying it and making other revolutions and wars and sending Iran 100 years more back in development process.

          "It's us who are being drilled with things"
          what for example? Please be clear. I really not understand what you mean?
          Do you have problem with Islam?
          if you mean problems in Iran government specially economical then I am with you.
          Khomeini said:
          "if Iran 100 times be destroyed and built again still Islamic revolution has higher value"
      • Jun 11 2011: 1- who are supporters of revolution and Imam Khomeini views (Shia)

        Do you still believe Imam Khmeini has got supporters in Iran??? If you think so, go to his speeches in youtube and read the comments.

        For example this video:
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LmmJEP17uE

        Comments are full of the worst curses you could imagine. Most of them not translatable in English.

        A few of the most popular comments under this video:
        "Khomeini I *** on you grave"
        "I wonder how this murderer could turn all these people into mules"
        "You aunt's ***"
        "Mother****"
        "This creature from hell is the reason why Iran is in the *** it is today."

        There is no exception on his talks in youtube, unless if the sender blocks comments.


        Why don't you show me ONLY ONE link from Khomeini were public commenting is open and it is not filled with hundreds of the worst hate comments?
        • Jun 12 2011: "Do you still believe Imam Khmeini has got supporters in Iran???"
          yes sure. please refer to 22 bahman parade in end of last year.

          "Comments are full of the worst curses you could imagine."
          OK. so what? you mean those comments represent the majority of Iranians?
          the majority of Iranians are not present in Internet.
          also it is clear Khomeini has many enemies its because their beliefs. all good people also all prophets had many enemies. like Jesus (PBUH) or Muhammad (PBUH) had many enemies.

          you mean because there is many curses comment SO Khomeini is a bad human?
          what kind of logic is this? so if some one make a curses comment under your movie in internet so you are a bad human?!

          there is a rule:
          if any one has strict believes Indeed he will have enemies.
          only people with flexible believes that change based on benefits have no enemy

          "Why don't you show me ONLY ONE link from Khomeini were public commenting is open and it is not filled with hundreds of the worst hate comments?"

          public comment is not a valid criteria about judgement about some one.

          Khomeini is clearly one of the humans who was the max matching in his deeds and morals and thinks and views and beliefs with Koran.

          it is clear if some one is enemy of Koran and Islam Indeed will hate Khomeini.

          if you want to say Koran is good but Khomeini had conflict with Koran then please show your evidence.

          Khomeini was like prophets and usually people curse prophets at their life. but when they die people deviate their sayings and then love that prophet because is not alive any more to defend himself and say many saying of people about him is lie.
        • Jun 12 2011: ""Why don't you show me ONLY ONE link from Khomeini were public commenting is open and it is not filled with hundreds of the worst hate comments?"

          public comment is not a valid criteria about judgement about some one."

          S.R. Ahmadi, if public opinion is not a valid criterea, what is? Information fed from the very group in question?
        • Jun 14 2011: "Just wanted to point that the source is a state propaganda source. "
          I have no special idea about reliability of that source. but are you sure it is a state website?
          please not that not any website seems Islamic is a state source.
          can you show some evidence it is a false or state source?
          I think you are prejudicing about farsnews. it is an independent news agency as itself say. but I showed pics. not text.
          also please note anti-revolution websites like BBC, CNN ,... never show such pics.
          for example you go to BBC website and search about 22 bahman parade and see how they showed [if even showd] this huge parade.
          when such pics can not be found in anti-revolution websites how I show from those sources?
          can you show me the pics of 22 bahman parade in BBC or CNN to all can compare them?
          and then it will be cleared which source is really propaganda.

          do you compare Ghazafi with Iran leaders?
          they not similar at all.
          although I not validate any behavior of Iran governors.
          please do not prejudice about me. I am not the fan of any behavior of governors of Iran. I only want to all have a true and real Image without any overstatement.
      • Jun 13 2011: "also it is clear Khomeini has many enemies its because their beliefs. all good people also all prophets had many enemies. like Jesus (PBUH) or Muhammad (PBUH) had many enemies."

        Seyed,
        First of all, I am not originally from Tehran, moved to Tehran for my university. Also "sha b" which is another Iranian posting here is from "Shahr Kord" which is a small and very conservative town. So don't claim that only Tehranians are against the regime.

        And about the popularity of Khomeini and public comments on youtube. Let's compare three figures with similar roles in the revolution 1979 and their public support in internet today.
        1. Mohammad Reza, former Shah of Iran: He had the most enemies of all. Basically everybody except the extreme minority of Monarchists were against him.
        2. Ayatollah Khomeini. He was the most popular figure at the time of revolution before getting the power. After getting the power and showing his real being, things changed gradually.
        3. Masoud Rajavi. Head of on of the best known (and once most strong) opposition groups of Islamic Republic. He also was popular at the revolution time.

        Now public comments from youtube (where public commenting is open) about these three figures:

        1. Shah: This video has 209K views
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaXW78R5fyY
        Basically the comments which are about Shah are more of critic nature (and some in favour). You don't see hate there in the comments.

        2.Khomeini:‌ This video has 100K views
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4rEdAj5uFbw
        Comments are full of hatred. The worst type you can imagine in Persian language.

        3.Masoud Rajavi: This video has 37K views
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdZVTyno2mc
        Similar hatred that you can see in comments on Khomeini.

        So 2 & 3 are oposite but are hated the same way. So if you think being hated on internet is the sign of prophecy, think again.
        • Jun 14 2011: Dear Naiem Yeganeh,
          "So don't claim that only Tehranians are against the regime."
          I have not such claim. but Tehran is the main.

          I never judge about people according to comments of youtube.
          the truth is not by comments of youtube.
          if you say any one any kind of comments can be found about it.
          also please note the fans of Khomeini nearly are not present in youtube. they mostly do not see you tube because many problems of Internet in Iran. a simple text page opens hard in Iran. also please note that most anti-revolution people out of Iran have access to high speed internet and easy can see and download YouTube movies. opening a YouTube movie in Iran is a high tech IT project with many hacks. then you want to Iranian fans of Khomeini go to YouTube and leave their comments there?
          please assume that I go to youtube and leave this comment under a movie of you:
          "Naiem Yeganeh is a donkey" [sorry I appologize]
          then you are really a donkey?
          please note that great people never think to the assaults of people to them and only think to their goal.
          I believe truth is not by what people say.
          truth is by wisdom and think and research and evidence and proof and history.

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