This conversation is closed.

How is the life of Arab youth in US and another European countries ?

As u know a lot of Arabs live in US and Uerope , I guess it's challenging espicially for Muslims to be joined in different societies and I will be really thankfull for any INFO about it.

Closing Statement from bassil ahmad

it was very helpful thanks to all of you .

  • Mar 8 2014: basil ahmad,

    I do not think it's challenging for Muslims to be joined in different societies within America.
    America is still the Grand Melting Pot, with over 100,000 new Muslims becoming American
    citizens every year.

    Muslims in America are only 1% of the population. But they and their religious beliefs are
    respected. I have never heard of any Arab youth being disrespected, except of course,
    because of youthful bad manners which would not be tolerated by any responsible adult.

    Americans are a culture that are used to dressing differently from each other, and used
    to attending different religious rites and praying differently. Some of us have different Gods.
    Some have No God. But all respect the Law that allows free expression of each individual's
    religion and beliefs. For those who do not respect this Law, we have Jails and Prisons
    for their comfort while they reflect their challenges.

    Send or bring your Arab youth to the US in safety. Our Bill of Rights protect us all.

    I doubt Arab youths will suffer from the knowledge of learning about Americans.

    No man can suffer corruption, lest he corrupt himself first.

    I doubt European countries are any different from where you or I live.
    I have only traveled to the Far East nations, and most if not all of those people
    are not different.

    Just a passing thought...
    I have read in our 'written and recorded history of the world', there have been
    11,000 different religions, and also 11,000 different wars.
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      Mar 11 2014: Thank you frank this is very helpful.
      But as I been told in here some of them doesn't seem to be living a great life in the US
      They might face some obstacles and i read about a lot of girls that had some issues at school because of their Hijab.
      • Mar 11 2014: Bassil, Thank you for your support and response.

        We in America have a social problem with the behavior of our youths.
        Around the time of 1960's in an attempt to control parent's violence upon children,
        corporal punishment was restricted by law. Results over the last 50 years or so
        indicate children tend to run wild without a heavy hand of the parent when needed.

        I haven't had personal experience concerning girls wearing their Hijab being made fun of,
        or being taunted by other children or even adults with little in the way of intellectual assets.
        But, I wouldn't rule out that happening. Not everyone in America is sophisticated.
        We Americans have our share of "dorks", "dummies", and "lunkheads".

        Life in the US is much like life anywhere else. No better, no worse. Life is what we make it.
        Those who choose to allow themselves to be beaten down, will be beaten down anywhere
        they choose to live. We are all masters of our souls.

        Obstacles are only put in front of us because we allow them to be there.
        Have you noticed that there are those who are trod upon, and those to whom that never occurs?
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          Mar 16 2014: yeah i have noticed frank
          thank you this have been helpful
          i appreciate it .
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          Mar 17 2014: I so understand your point, Frank. You do not need to agree with me.

          I've had my own experience as well - we've had to hire and fire service people all the time.... beside other problems we had to deal with some special "ethnic" or religios attitude. I think when we serve Public we shall not demostrate our personal beliefs/"styles" or ideas, otherwise we abuse the public institution we serve, general ethics, and even compromise our job position.

          In any case my point was that the basic ethical rules have to be learned in our very childhood. We live in colossal mixed-up crowds and we could make great progress if we all follow the same rules in terms of not disturbing others' minds and psychology for no good reason, and maintain our peaceful co-existence in postmodern dense crowds. I think we need to come up with a few basic international (global) rules towards our ethics, no matter where we live.
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          Mar 17 2014: From what you are saying - you're a graceful soul. You're a grateful person too - you still remember your rare experience in that hospital. I usually do my very best to thank someone and remember when someone honestly and selflessly has helped me.... it is very rare.

          Well, regarding our maners and attitudes, I only believe that the hope is in teaching ethics and EXPLAINING ethics in elementary schools, when young minds are still uncorrupted and have some natural intuition.

          I think every class in elementary school shall become a small sustainable society of different characters, with different talents and problems, while practicing HOW TO CO-EXIST and cooperate as different individuals, who are peacefully combining various uniqe abilities, opinions, tastes, skills or knowledge.
        • Mar 24 2014: We in America have a social problem with the behavior of our youths.
          Around the time of 1960's in an attempt to control parent's violence upon children,
          corporal punishment was restricted by law. Results over the last 50 years or so
          indicate children tend to run wild without a heavy hand of the parent when needed.

          Are you sure about this...? Despite the bad economy today, how does the teenage pregnancy rate and and murder rate of 2014 compare to 1960? Have you looked at the stats?

          Corporate punishment is rarely used by Japanese parents and they have a pretty good economy and discipline despite no natural resources, I believe.

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        Mar 17 2014: It is always a problem when we demostrate our ethnic or religious groups in any mixed society in public, especially in the society that has been established based upon Christian/Western culture.

        To avoid this problem we need to learn that our looks and behavior shall never manifest our own group to the rest of the population, which is not only different in many ways but has exprienced terroristic acts coming from that very group.

        One who does not want to blend with the rest of the society in which one chooses to live, and does not want to really join others, speak local language and respect the law -- commonly looks as a potential threat or challenge. It is crucially important for the young to blend with the majority in order to be accepted as the majority member.

        We do not learn in schools how to respect one another as unique individuals, and therefore, we do not ever practice how to peacefully CO-EXST in one society as different individuals, with different mentalities.

        If a Muslim woman, as well as an African black woman, is dressed in her religios or ethnic outfit for an interview to get a job in the US bank - a national commercial institution uniforming its repect to all clients - most likely, these women will not get any job. It is simply UNETHICAL to manifest our specific religious or cultural groups and at the same time try to represent a commercial institution.

        I'd prefer to deal with an individual who is PERSONALLY reponsible for his/her own behavior. The youngsters commonly imitate one another, this means, no matter what group they think they belong to, their behavior and mentality make them brainless and irrisponsible for their own action.

        I'd say if we want peace among ourselves we have to learn how to grow up as unique individuals and respect others as thinking, ethical individuals.
        • Mar 17 2014: Vera, I am sorry but I cannot agree with
          your reasoning concerning getting a job in the US Bank.

          My reasons are based upon only my experience.
          I personally have hired and fired many employees.
          Only once has the applicant's appearance and dress mode
          determined my decision. It was too physically disgusting
          to describe here.
        • Mar 17 2014: Vera. Thanks.
          I've had unique experience in my recent past... now 13 years ago...
          I was operated on in a VA Hospital... During my more than 6 months
          of convalescence.I noticed, as I grew stronger and moved from bed to
          walking the hospital halls, the people providing care or services were
          always pleasant and comfortable to be around... In the 6 months spent
          inside the hospital, I never heard a 'harsh' word spoken. Not one !!

          There were plenty of 'harsh' words from the patients in pain.
          But none from the staff.

          If we all took lessons in being pleasant and comfortable to be around...
          The TED moderators only know me to be a cranky sort... lol
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          Mar 17 2014: "I think every class in elementary school shall become a small sustainable society of different characters, with different talents and problems, while practicing HOW TO CO-EXIST and cooperate as different individuals, who are peacefully combining various uniqe abilities, opinions, tastes, skills or knowledge."

          I think this has become a very great focus in modern schooling over the last decade, not just at elementary but also at secondary- to consider and build a learning community of this kind in every classroom we teach.
      • Mar 27 2014: That problem does exist in parts of the USA. It's not specifically anti-Muslim but a symptom of those parts of the country that cling to outdated ideas of "proper" and "correct". It was not too long ago that Catholics were discriminated against in the USA. People wouldn't even think of that in the present day. There are parts of the country where nobody cares if someone is Muslim. There are parts where the people think everyone must be a Baptist. Fortunately, the first type of region is getting more common and the second less common.
    • Mar 24 2014: Are all Arabs automatically Muslim? This would be news to the Christian Arabs (whose families have been Christian longer than Islam has existed) of my acquaintance.
      • Mar 25 2014: Bryan, your mind is a steel trap.
        You catch it all. lol

        Religions won't matter much in the deserts when Global Warming
        starts to dry up the dry spots on earth. All the Arabs will move to
        higher ground, and those living on higher ground will be forced to
        accommodate the newbies.

        It will be the advent of the Water Gods. Gourds will become the
        ancient artifacts, priceless. Water tables will be revered. Secret
        wells will be dug in basements, and when the neighbors find out,
        off with the digger's heads. The guillotine might make a come back.

        Bryan, Think I have a chance for a movie or maybe a tv series?
        • Mar 27 2014: Do not follow the gourd! Follow the shoe!
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    Mar 7 2014: I believe human nature is here to stay. You cannot legislate love and that is what it takes to resolve conflicts. Some reasons might be that some people have never been exposed to love and therefore don't practice it. Some people live reactively, by instinct instead of rationally. We hope thatwe will continue to progress towards mutual beneficence.
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      Mar 7 2014: That's a good idea love can solve everything
      But who do you think is never been exposed to love
      And why ?
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        Mar 7 2014: Persons who had an abusive childhood and are filled with anger. People who are born with brain problems and I do exclude Down's Syndrome and autism. Those born with addictions derived from the mother. I am not saying these states need to be permanent. There therapies available to restore people to rationality.
        • Mar 8 2014: Helen, please allow me this response.
          I have current experience with "Persons who had an abusive childhood
          and are filled with anger. People who are born with brain problems...
          Those born with addictions derived from the mother.". and the father.

          During the act of conception, while blind drunk or loaded, with blood
          saturated in alcohol and hard drugs, both semen and egg contain a
          poison that almost surely will result in crippling the fetus. It makes
          little difference which is the poisoner. ..Both are effective killers of
          the future of a human being.

          That feel good feeling isn't love. ..It's a guaranteed future involving a
          grandparent raising the child of the blind drunk or loaded conceivers,
          and welfare checks instead of wages, and educations terminated by
          poor conduct of the poisoned students, and jail time for thefts, and
          spousal battery and Prison for worse crimes.

          In America Prohibition existed briefly, from 1920 to 1933.

          President Warren G. Harding 1921 -1923 wrote during Prohibition;
          "In every community, men and women have had an opportunity
          now to know what Prohibition means. They know that debts are
          more promptly paid, and that men take home their wages once
          wasted, that families are better clothed and fed, and (that) more
          money finds its way into the savings banks.

          ..In another generation, I believe that liquor will have disappeared,
          not only from our politics but from our memories."
          Apparently that didn't happen, and the legacy is what we have today.
  • Mar 6 2014: Helen:
    That is nice and you look very successful and are. Young Facebook CEO has all you said. Bu he is much more. He cares to make world nicer place. To me Character is at the top. I hope society is not measured by the how much our rich have but how much the least among are treated and have enough to eat, pay rent and raise kids in a decent society. I am not a religious person. However I am mindful of what Jesus said: Treat others as you will like to be treated. I never forget that above all I am human and so are all the other humans.

    I have traveled this country from one end to other. I have met poor and rich, fortunate and unfortunate. I know American dream that you defined is slipping away from our young people. Our rich and connected are getting richer while out middle class are heading towards poverty of life time.

    I am not Arab nor Muslim, not poor and not very rich, educated, active, knowledgeable and considered with a good ability to think on simple and complex issue better than most.

    If any solace to you, Arabs in this country have achieved American Dream. In Education, income, family love, very little crime rate compared to all ethnic groups. We have had our mass killers, cannibals, serial pedophiles, Arabs have their share of criminals. We have domestic terrorist and they have too.

    I am able to see people with equal way as Jesus or Mohammad would have liked us to. I am not for demonizing based on labels. We have done that to American Indians, Jews, Blacks, Chinese,Japanese. women, gays. It is time to move on and to build a character when world is getting smaller and smaller.

    In death we are all equal.

    I admire you and perhaps in person we will get along well. I admire women who are able to speak their mind. That is why I admire Barbara Bush (eternally fresh and noble) and Hillary Clinton.
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      Mar 7 2014: Raj :

      This is absolutely logic and shows how aware you are and this is the way that ppl should be treated
      But do all of americans and european in general take things in this perspective
      Because I have heard it a lot " muslims means terrorist "
      For sure there's a lot of muslim terrorists that convince them self that there religion ask them to do territory actions serving their religious believes
      is it being taken as a rule ?
      So is this affecting on the life of young teenagers ?
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    Mar 6 2014: I'm not Muslim, so I really can't speak from personal experience. However, the University where I work (Fontbonne) is a catholic institution with a large international population (at least considering its size). Although the institutional history reflects a different faith tradition, there is continuous effort to involve those from other faiths in community and development. I sit on the Mission and Heritage committee with Catholics, Buddhists, and Muslims.

    The only advice I can give is to look for support for your faith. Obviously it helps if there is a population of Muslims to serve as that support, but you'll also want to look for people who aren't Muslim, but value what you can bring to the community. Personally, I'm so grateful for the perspective Arab students bring to our classes and I'm always happy to hear about how comfortable our Muslim students feel here (not something you would expect at a small Catholic University)
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    Apr 1 2014: Growing up is difficult no matter where you are let's just be honest. When you tack on living in a foreign country, dressing differently, speaking a different language, any feeling of isolation or misunderstanding it just intensifies and exacerbates those feelings that would exist no matter what your lot in life at that age.

    American youth can't be generalized in any way, we have all kinds. Any category a youth can fall into is a category found in abundance anywhere in any state at any time.

    The challenges found here are only slight variations of the difficulties found anywhere.

    How is the life of an Arab youth in the US??? Depending on what their parents are like, how much money they make, the school they go to, their level of motivation, and how active they are in school and other extracurricular activities, I'd wager their lives are about the same as any youth anywhere.
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    Mar 27 2014: integrating into any society whether eastern, western, middle eastern has it's challenges due to upbringings different cultural mindsets, people have their ways of understanding
    like for instance how in Islam devout Muslims should cherish the concept of jihad
    which most westerners would find appalling or just down right insane
    or maybe the carpet bombing of American fighter jets and drones which is all in the name of Freedom
    is not seen that way by the innocent people whose lives have to pay the price
    in no way should anyone kill an innocent soul but it happens everyday and will continue so until the end of time
    when uneducated radical scholars give false fatwa which has nothing to do with the Sunnah but it is to do with his desires and enmity towards foreign policies, it wont effect him as much as it does the Ummah
    same thing goes for the hardcore right-wing conservatives who behind the freedom of speech act preach hatred and slander the name of Islam which doesn't bring problems upon himself but rather the innocent
    it's a shame that all the evil actions of the evil person tends to afflict the innocent
  • Mar 26 2014: In response to Alexis Rodirugez

    Yes Alexis, I am sure about the sudden lack of corporal punishment in the 1960's.
    I lived through those times, and seen the youths corrupted by both poor character,
    and the drug culture. Americans blame ourselves for using 'feel good' drugs, until
    the drugs end up using us, and wrecking the good we once were.

    I read the child rearing studies from the link you provided. A bit one-sided, I thought.
    The Japanese do raise their children differently. Not better, nor worse, than Americans.
    While living in Japan with a Japanese family for several years, I enjoyed seeing the
    children off to school in their uniforms. The Japanese are perhaps the most mannerly
    of all societies. Although, the girl I loved most told me Americans smelled like bovines.
    I changed my diet.

    I've traveled widely, but never experienced any society that was different towards how
    new people are assimilated into the local culture. Maybe a strange look or two, while
    passing in the street, but nothing else. Until some odd-ball idiot stirs up trouble, the
    rest of us just get along. Adolf Hitler comes to mind... lol
  • Mar 24 2014: Boring. Most of the time in the USA, I'd say it's quite boring to be Arab. Just guessing from the ordinary lives the Arabs I am acquainted with seem to be having.
  • Mar 17 2014: Fritzie, -- I agree with your view.

    My experience with Grade school 1 - 6 and Jr. High School 7 - 9, was more than
    just rewarding... It was my religion, my wall to lean against, a place where I could
    lose myself in learning and participating... (All while my family disintegrated.)

    When I attended High School, 10th only, all that changed... I hated that I was expected
    to become a peer... I most often fought fist-fights with those I perceived had no constraints
    or parental guidance... I took a job midway of through my 10th year, several jobs actually,
    and when of age, joined the Air Force.

    My education could have ended, but the Air Force was generous... I did my duties, Korea
    and Japan... 3 years later in Vermont, with the blessings of my Commanding Officer,
    I attended the local High School for 2 semesters and Graduated... Algebra straight "A's",
    French also "A's" and "B's", Chemistry "A's", English Literature, I flunked with an "F" at
    mid-term, but by the end of the year, "A's".

    In 2 short semesters, I had experienced "Learning".
    I was a bit older than the rest of the student body... Not much, but enough to value education.
    From there, my world was "everything I could try to learn"... And I did... And I still do.

    Fritzie, I do think that "age" plays a part in how we learn... Perhaps a break in schooling might
    be found to be beneficial... A break to allow our youths to work at special jobs where they can
    see the results of their labors... With our youths becoming coarse and delinquent in many ways,
    we adults need to find an answer other than jail, probation, and other enforcement practices.
    Those things make enemies out of perfectly good people... ..SAD.
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      Mar 18 2014: I think, Frank, that people have very different experiences with their schooling but that many have found it a refuge from difficult home situations as you did. But schooling today is not what it was in the middle of the last century. The academic standards are much higher now, and classroom organization and pedagogy have changed. But people tend to believe that schooling is the same everywhere and that it looks just like their experience of decades ago.

      Many "new" proposals put forward by those not integrally involved in modern education have already been popular in schools for a decade or two.

      I think you are correct that some people are not ready to take full advantage of the opportunities that are offered them at a particular time and would perhaps get more value from alternatives.
      • Mar 18 2014: Fritzie - In a very limited area,
        I would argue that you are mistaken when you state
        "The academic standards are much higher now..."

        I supposed, 50+years ago, when those West Point Cadet's who cheated
        on their exams were caught, that Universities would stand up for Integrity
        and Honor. Instead we got Saturday Football and Instant Replay Cameras.
        The fellow who may 'not' have caught the ball, never saying that he didn't.
        Somehow, Penn State comes to mind.

        Have you ever wondered about the benefits paid to the 50 state leaders
        of our Educational sub-structures, those revered Superintendent's?

        We taxed payers do wonder where our taxes are returned in services.
        And how we elected highly-educated candidates who then lie and cheat.
        The answers are always found where you count the money, retirement.

        I may be a bit cranky this morning. My diabetic meds were just changed.
  • Mar 11 2014: You have asked two different questions. One asks about Arab youth, to which I would answer that they are no different from all the other countries which people have come from. Each immigrant has kept a portion of their culture while adopting other American ways. So just being Arab, European or Oriental really has no meaning - everyone is the same.

    The second question, however, was 'for Muslims'. America was not created for Islam. In fact you will see other religions well represented. When you come to America you are expected to fit in and tolerate others opinions and religions. Islam does not allow that. So Muslims should expect to remain outsiders - not truly American. I propose that there is no way for Muslims to be part of America, because by definition they expect to force everyone to think, act and worship the way Islam wants. That is not American, nor would the resulting country be America if it were to come about.
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      Mar 17 2014: martin i think u should read a lot about Islam not depending on what u have experienced and then if u are a wise men u will be sure that all of what u have said is WRONG
      but thanks for your participation .
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    Mar 11 2014: What I know they rather enjoy a free life there......
  • Mar 7 2014: Sharia Law:

    "Thous shall be subservient to a man and live in pain and sorrow.Not exact script but it is essential. God cursed womern (eve) for listening to serpent to eat forbidden fruit of knowledge.

    Basically version of it is found in Jewish Law practiced in Israel by some and some of the laws are based on that. Christians ignores them like they ignores most of the Bibles and whole thing is substituted by saying "Jesus is the way" and not teachings of old and new testament, Many Muslim society practices them but most people and laws are in Muslim countries do not confirm to the sharia laws.

    The more conservative and remote is the location in all societies conservatism and refuge to older versions of the laws is more common. With education and dominance of technology, in all societies religions is in retreat in most of the punitive teachings and are now sands for basic things of life like birth, marriage and deaths,

    In all religions there is vanishing but strong movements who are aggressively promoting those values, In USA it has been anti women, anti blacks, anti gays, anti progressive reproductive issues etc.

    But in all these issues we are getting freer.

    Unfortunately technology is more and more enslaving us in new ways and are greater threats to average person irrespective of any religion dictate. Super rich and smart technology giants dominate our lives and will continue to do so. Rich and powerful have gripped us in a new kind of Sharia. Unlike religious Sharia , the technology sharia victims have no idea how to be free of that oppression. Brave New world is here.
  • Mar 4 2014: There is some nervousness like blacks youth have. But they get on with their life, work hard, try to succeed in school and get smart and ultimately get rich. Mostly they try to get along. Some time some one presses their nerve, some youth like hanger boils over and they feel what America says and do are two different things, However this is rarity. Most rather succeed. They know they have a chance if they work hard. Most of the parents will spend large percentage of their income and attention to young kids well being.

    Most Arab and rest of the eastern Asia are pretty nice people. The youth coming from Pakistan and some of the middle eastern and Caucasian countries can have little larger percentage of radicalism due to active movements taking place there and their sense of oppression can be greater. If they have exposure to such events, it does not help,

    But most of them are very smart and academically and job wise do well.
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      Mar 7 2014: Raj:
      As you said about middle eastern people your saying that they might have some radicalism do you to active movements their do you think that the people who move to the US Looking for a new better life are connected to these movements or believe in them ?! And How you came up with this separating of valuing eastern people.
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    Mar 4 2014: A family friend is Arab. She comes from a well-educated family, all five children graduated college. The father is a business man. They live in a million dollar house in a nice suburb of San Francisco. All drive luxury cars. They're living the American Dream.

    Our neighbors are Arab, too. They drive some of the nicest cars. Seems to me they are better than average, financially. All children graduated from college. They too are living the American Dream.

    Anyone can make it for as long as one is willing to start fresh (leave his/her baggage, preconceive notions, angst, and prejudices behind), study hard, work hard, make the right choices, and focus on the limitless opportunities America offers.

    The USA is still one of the best, if not the best, places to start a new life and succeed. America is the land of second chances. As they say, ONLY IN AMERICA!
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      Mar 6 2014: Right ! But then there are those who rather hang on to their grudges. No?
      • Mar 6 2014: We hold grudges too, It is not a monopoly of any race , religions, culture. Even within our political system and interpersonal relations that is everywhere. May be you are nice lady and forgive every one and are like Edith in Archie Bunkers Place sitcom.
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          Mar 6 2014: If success (American dream) is measured by the oollege education, money, nice cars, big house etc) then surely you miss a lot. I too have Arab friends, namely a Doctor who saved my life some years ago. I am a nice lady.
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        Mar 6 2014: Are tensions and conflicts between individuals and nations permanent element of the human condition? Are we getting better or worse when it comes to resolving tensions and conflicts?
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          Mar 8 2014: I didn't know what does Shariah means i had to translate it !!
          But we have always learned that in Islam and christianity things are totally the same when it comes to love, respect,criminal actions are disallowed so the two religions are calling for good morals & good treatment between people.
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        Mar 7 2014: Helen :
        About Arabs especially Muslims do you have like a general concept about them or it depends
        I mean as a family at home sometimes you might be a very good person but your brother is a criminal or just like a bad person
        So how about millions of people ?
        As i said to mrs to Raj i have heard it a lot Muslims are terrorist with no exceptions it's like they are taking it as a general concept !
        I wish that i could get your opinion more clear
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          Mar 7 2014: It is my belief that all Muslims are not terrorists, just as all Christians were not Crusaders .I don't know exactly what Sharia law is about and whether that is part of the Muslim religion.
          Perhaps you can enlighten me. Peace