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Bernard White


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Does creationism indicate bad education? (If so how can we fix this, and should it be taught?) Does Creationism have any credibility to it?

I started this debate, with a new aspect (or perspective) on our current education problem. Considering many focus on how to motivate students and various other aspects. Yet this (creationism) still remains a big problem to the American education system today, and I don't think many people think about this when they consider the education system today.

I feel I should have probably made this clearer, when I say creationism, I am making reference to the type of creationism which tell people "Evolution is wrong". (Or in other words the "Creationism vs Evolution" debate).

Creationism - http://www.creationism.org/
Does it have any credibility to it? Should it be considered a science?
Considering due to recent polls 46% of American believe in creationism.
Link :
- http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/05/americans-believe-in-creationism_n_1571127.html

Many psychological studies have shown a strong correlation between a lack of education and creationism. These studies indicate that not many creationists actually understand what the scientific method is.
With all this talk of how to "improve education" surely it would be wise, to finally finish the "Creationism vs Evolution" debate, if we wish to ensure a better scientific education!
Watch this 3 minute link : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTedvV6oZjo (By Lawrence Krauss)

Here are some reasons, people believe creationism should be taught in schools, which I believe are false :
Considering, if the polls are to be believed, 46% of Americans are missing out (in my opinion) on a proper scientific education.

I think it is worth mentioning though, that I am fine with "Theistic evolution".
A good book recommendation on this matter is "Finding Darwin's God: A Scientist's Search for Common Ground Between God and Evolution" by Kenneth R. Miller. I personally have never understood the claim "Atheism = Evolution"...


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    Jun 12 2013: As this conversation gets to the end... and reading most of these comments, I am still not convinced that the teaching of creationism hasn't any appreciable effect on the educational crisis is public schools. Considering the the vast majority if not all public schools do not teach these subjects. Public school education is failing without the help of religious beliefs. Private and parochial school are doing better in teaching according to most measures.

    As far as creditably goes, like beauty, it is in the eye of the beholder....

    Good run, Bernie
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      Jun 12 2013: I agree! :-) Thanks for your comment! :D
      I do sometimes wonder myself whether certain statistics are to be trusted, like according to some polls (as cited) roughly 50% of Americans are meant to be creationists (and the statistic which claims 70% of people in the world believe in some Deity). This isn't that surprising to me, considering we are intuitive (or inherent) creationists (Evolutionary thinking doesn't come naturally). However according to another poll, more people believe in the Devil (60%) and hell (61%) than in evolution. While it is worrying that 42% believe in Ghosts and 32% believe in UFO's! Very worrying!
      Yet I do think there is enough data to suggest that creation is correlated (I would be inclined to argue causation) with a poor level of a scientific education. I strongly believe that science shouldn't really be democratic, in the way of "teaching of controversy". (Not to say people shouldn't be allowed freedom of speech, or be allowed to pose opposing theories!)
      Regards (as always),
      P.S: I was really enjoying your TED Conversation! It does seem quite an important issue. If you don't mind me asking (honestly), have I ever insulted you? (I hope not!) Personally I'v always wondered why so many people are intolerant (and cruel) to eachother on Youtube, while on TED everybody is so respectful!
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        Jun 12 2013: Thanks Bernie,
        No, there has only been a very few times that I felt a phrase in response to me was a little over the top. But, I have seen some real zingers out there in the few months I have been on TED. I think some do not respond well to challenges to their point of view. So it is. Maybe, my talk will remind people that harsh speech doesn't really win many arguments and refrain from that sort of language.
        You got a point on polls. I saw some really questionable out there during our last elections.
        I have a couple of kids who are educators. One in Math and one in History/Civics. They have both told me that college level scientist do not go into teaching. The money is in Industry. So, if you have a class in college chemistry, you can be hired as a science teacher for high school. I said a class. Or course, you will also have biology and physics classes. This is more likely then the fact the Johnny doesn't know about the sciences because he heard about the Garden of Eden last Sunday.
        Moreover, teachers are not really teaching any more. They are educational facilitators.
        They handout workbooks addressing the state exams and answer any questions the student may have about the workbooks. They grade the workbooks and return to the student with explanations of how he may do better. They proctor the state exams, hoping their students do well as their jobs depend on it.
        So, then US is way behind the world in Math and Science... we don't do well in language arts either.
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        Jun 13 2013: "While it is worrying that 42% believe in Ghosts and 32% believe in UFO's! Very worrying!"

        Bernard, thanks for the conversation and the topic that generated so many disparate comments, and points of view.

        What should "worry" you about beliefs in Ghosts and UFOs is not that people are somehow inept thinkers, gullible, or irrational, but that the significantly high number of beliefs suggests the plenitude of encountered apparitions and UFO events that gave rise to these numbers.

        These beliefs generally have a basis in people's experiences, whether you believe them to be credible or not.

        The History Channel has run a program titled, "I Know What I Saw." I believe that it's about 5 segments long, and can be seen on YouTube. See link below. Regarding UFO sightings, many notables, including President Jimmy Carter, have claimed to have seen a UFO.

        One parting word: Were you privy to all that's occurring on this planet, you'd be amazed, and then amazed again.


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