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Charan Singh

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What is the opposite of "Idea " ?

Concept / idea - what could be the most closest opposite of it ?

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natasha nikulina 50+
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Mar 7 2013: Charan, hi again ! :)
Coming back to your topic, how idea and form are not distinct, as i suggested. It's pretty simple: the idea/dream of flight creates the airplane. In this case what human mind does is making lemons from lemonade, the Nature is busy with the reverse : nothing lasts. But nothing lost either and an airplane shapes human mind differently, it is not the same as before, the very fabric of Time has changed , the time is speeding up. Let alone the Internet...here is the Marshal McLuhan's idea is in action : the media is the message. Iow. everything is a flux. vexed chicken egg question.
What i am trying to say is : Reality is illusion of MIND , and i don't mean human mind only, Human mind is the major player in creating virtual reality we inhabit and it is done through language, by language i mean any kind of expression. Human mind , whatever it is , is not prior to reality. There is no causality here ; it's concrescence, they grow together. But MIND is beyond language and casts the shadow over human mind.
What is IT ? Have no idea ! A Mystery.

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Please, keep in mind, i am modeling my understanding of ' everything ' , being perfectly aware that
i don't know :)
- Charan Singh
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  Mar 7 2013: nn- thanks for these tips on further exploring your questions, esp reference of McLuhen - Though it seems, 'Ape_Me_Un' ( As per my evolving understanding ;) ) " Reality is illusion of MIND" seems incorrect. There should be something that connects all phases "I" undergo as consciousness/ awareness shuttling between memory /mind ... wait till we collectively find it ;) before and after learning a language - and simple enough at the ground level not complicated at all !! not virtual
  - natasha nikulina 50+
    
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    Mar 7 2013: " There should be something that connects all phases "I" undergo as consciousness/ awareness shuttling between memory /mind ... wait till we collectively find it ;) "
    
    That's the point ! Reality is MIND's creation, it is not the Holy Other, it's all that is/were collectively. We don't remember that we have always been and have always participated in creation and after being separated again re-discover our own creation. As you said ( if i understand you right ) Amnesia is an interval to push the creation forward. What connects all phases ? There is no Past, everything that was is here and now and everything that most likely shall be is here too. Or let's say : we know where the road goes , but we don't know how the scinery will look like.
    We agree that we are One , but don't take it as a basic premise in modeling our understanding how this world/reality works.
    - Casey Christofaris 10+
      
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      Mar 7 2013: I am still not sure why Charan is trying to find this underlying connection when the connection is literally everything
    - Casey Christofaris 10+
      
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      Mar 8 2013: Don't we ask questions to get answers
    - Casey Christofaris 10+
      
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      Mar 8 2013: I guess I would need to know why he is so pressed to find this 1 universal common denominator.
      
      When also realizing that we are one
    - Charan Singh
      
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      Mar 8 2013: #casey - It seems it is for the reason of objectivity - we are one everyone says and I agree , however, it seems a general statement - are we one ? does language /sound /voice /vision connects us - If something is not measurable we need to work together to develop /find that. On a positive note if the connection is found - more compassion, fellowship, collaboration will flow amongst us.It seems it is an idea of working together to find an answer to a question for which the knowledge is spread all around - amongst us. Currently - it seems a slogan only , that we are all connected, we are one - and so on. Finding Something more solid would be helpful
    - Charan Singh
      
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      Mar 8 2013: @Casey - "1 universal common denominator" - Is not an Idea !! but opposite of idea that needs to be found with knowledgeable, wise men around :such as TED, Or in communities or like minded friends, fellow seekers of Truth, - that will connect Plato's abstract with the form . That will likely help humanity understand FORM IS NOT AN ILLUSION /DREAM/UNREAL either -In this world of ideas/ concept there are several challenges - 1) everything is through language - even considering "we are one " is an idea, unless connected through that thread - 1 universal common denominator" that connects the core with the idea !! As idea it may have a beginning, sustenance for some time then regeneration/recycle, When the Common Connector is identified barriers imposed by anguage will not stop one in cycles of idea 2) Can one experience a World without words / written -verbal - non verbal ( considering non verbal - visual as codes of a language ) ? Yet language is invented by those human like us who knew the connection and competently laid the maps for connection through language - thus the language in a broader sense a mean to connect all as well. FINALLY on a back of a IC electronic chip circuit - one can see the connection/ joins Without that can those electronic parts talk to each other and manifest ? Thats how important it seems this common connector is....
  - Casey Christofaris 10+
    
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    Mar 7 2013: it a pattern ....which is another way of saying .....everything
    - natasha nikulina 50+
      
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      Mar 7 2013: Understanding is the apperception of pattern as such.
      The number of patterns is infinite, that's what William Blake's " to see infinity in the grain of sand ..." is about.
    - natasha nikulina 50+
      
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      Mar 8 2013: Is it possible to ask the question if you don't have the answer ?
      I think, the problem is verbalisation, it's hard to talk about unspeakable :)
    - natasha nikulina 50+
      
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      Mar 8 2013: Don't we ask questions to get answers
      
      I'd like to quote you, but don't remember exactly how you put it, something like :
      i don't have all answers, we do.
      Actually, we don't have either, but more versions more coherence, i guess.
    - Charan Singh
      
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      Mar 8 2013: @Natasha - It seemsWilliam Blake's quote is more reflective on becoming humble , like an Ant / like a Sand/like a grain to - losing one's false Id , as your often referenced
      
      U r right likely "hard to talk about unspeakable " or what connects the unspeakable with speakable ;)
- reine des violettes
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  Mar 7 2013: What is the opposite to 'illusion' ?
  - natasha nikulina 50+
    
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    Mar 7 2013: Consciousness. It can be described as "jumping over your shadow" or braking the code, something like this. i guess. But i don't think it's opposite to illusion. Consciousness is where all opposites are reconciled.
    Thanks for asking ! :)
  - Charan Singh
    
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    Mar 7 2013: @Reine - When "I" loose "Eye" ( the second I in the illusion) on anything, that seems like - what is Illusion !! so opposite possibly be something with no distraction - Clear Vision and Firm ;) - from an adopted son of -English as Mother tongue. @ nn - possibly what nn might approve me saying - where i (small i) reconciles with I ( large I) - ;)
    - natasha nikulina 50+
      
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      Mar 7 2013: Maybe this is the same dichotomous tension that haunts individual in his/her relationship to Dao.
      We don't want to be lost in ego, but on the other hand if we completely express the Dao, we have no sense of self.
      The ideal seems to be a paradoxical state where what we have is Dao, but we perceive it as ego.
      Something like this :)
    - natasha nikulina 50+
      
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      Mar 8 2013: Re : from an adopted son of -English as Mother tongue.
      
      Does it mean that English is not your first language ?
      If you don't mind me asking :)

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