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Science and Religion

These comments have been moved from the Brian Cox talk. Please continue the conversation here. Thanks!

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  • richard louis

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    Dec 29 2012: why do people listen to this man? does he believe in Jesus? people seem to think that "science" is the most important thing, while they move onward and onward to an eternal lake of fire. listen to God!

    • Tony Burbank

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      Dec 29 2012: Well not everyone can hear god so until there is proof we will look at science

      • richard louis

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        Dec 29 2012: well, just to let you know, there will never be proof, at least not the way you think about it; but if you were to have the perspective of the holy angels, for example, you would see that to not believe is what is really unbelievable.

        • Tony Burbank

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          Dec 30 2012: You say that there will never be proof, then what reason do you have for believing? You come to TED where logical and intelligent people come to listen to the brilliant works of other logical people talking about their respective topics. Almost every person here listens to reason and logic so since you admitted that there will never be any evidence for god then this might not be the best place to preach your cause. If I were to see through the eyes of a holy angel then I'm sure I'd see heaven, but then again if I looked through the eyes of Mister Spock I'd see aliens. Before I can see through the eyes of a holy angel I first need to know that they're there

      • richard louis

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        Dec 30 2012: Well, I just think it is quite more something that a man parted the Red sea than someone knows how to do equations. I think most people would agree with me. I'm not saying it's wrong to do equations; it's just that in the big equation, doing little equations doesn't add up to a whole lot compared to believing or not believing in things that happened a long time ago that we have a record of that none of the modern day equationists could touch with an infinite pole.

        • Tony Burbank

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          Dec 31 2012: Well, I think it is quite more something that a boy who didn't know he was a wizard got to go to a wizarding school than a scientist discovering a new type of plant, but then again one is in real life and the other in the fiction section. It really doesn't matter which is more astounding because it takes facts to prove anything. Watching Chris Angel do magic is quite amazing but I don't think it's a miracle. Just because something unexplained happened doesn't mean it's magic

      • richard louis

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        Dec 31 2012: It's sad that you liken Moses parting the Red sea to Harry Potter. How difficult is it for you to believe that a God Who created everything could suspend the laws of nature whenever He wanted, to do whatever He wanted? Fiction may be fiction, but it still exists, even as fiction, and for anything to exist, there had to be a cause. That cause is God. I didn't say what Chris Angel does is a miracle. Chris Angel never made a man born blind able to see.

        • Alexandre Anoutchine

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          Dec 31 2012: If one day the science is capable of giving the sight to a blind man, will it be a miracle for you? How difficult is it for you to believe that Santa is real?

          The question is why do you choose to believe in something instead of looking for facts? Probably because it is more simple to do so or you wish it be true.

          When i was young i believed the Santa was real (or i wished) but the fact is it's not.

        • Tony Burbank

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          Dec 31 2012: If there were a god I'm sure he would be able to suspend the laws of nature whenever he wanted to , but the problem is, the only documentation of it happening comes from a book written 2000 years ago by Christians. That's why it is difficult to believe there is a god, because the only people who have seen these acts of god use god to explain what happens around them. I see lightning and realize that it is caused by the build up of electrons while most theists in the era of 0 B.C. believed it was caused by a god. They came up with this explanation because they did not have the technology to come to reasonable conclusions, but now we do.

          "For anything to exist it must have been created", OK, I'm with you so far. "The cause is god" Well I'm afraid that is missing some logic. Scientists have a very good understanding of how life, the earth, the sun, the moon and the universe were created. Although the beginning of the universe is not completely understood, scientists are constantly working on solutions and there are multiple theories, that's much more than the christian community has been doing.

          You are allowed to have your beliefs but when you are trying to hold back the development of human understanding of the universe you are punishing society as a whole. Although you might not agree with science completely, we can use it to make predictions about the universe and create new scientific laws that rarely falter and new technologies that benefit society so until you can show us that believing in god is a good thing please refrain from preaching about his greatness.

      • richard louis

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        Dec 31 2012: Why can't God cause lightning and use the science behind it like you explained? Why is it so hard for you to believe that this awesome universe was created by an awesome God? It is because you have put so much stuff in your head, you can no longer be childlike and see what is right before you. Well, I don't want to hold back scientific progress, just hogwash, which evolution is. The Bible, in the book of Daniel, talks about knowledge increasing in the end times. We have exponentially increased in knowledge in the last century. The end times are here. Judge and see those things Daniel prophesied and see that they came to pass. His word about the increase of knowledge and the end times is true also. What do you know about the Hittites, for example?

        • richard louis

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          Dec 31 2012: i don't think just anyone could build one of these machines or make brian cox.

        • Tony Burbank

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          Jan 1 2013: The reason it is still so hard to believe in god is because you are still lacking any reason why I should believe he is there. Maybe god does cause lightning but we have no reason to believe that he does. You also called yourself childish...I'm good with that. You have not given any reason on why evolution is wrong other than the bible says so and knowledge has been increasing since the beginning of human history.

          I'm not sure what you're trying to say about not anyone could build the LHC or make Brian Cox, it just sounds very weird the way you put it. The people who made the LHC are extremely intelligent scientists who have dedicated their lives to discovering the hidden aspects of the universe. Brian Cox on the other hand was made by his parents.

      • richard louis

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        Jan 1 2013: Well, I have had an email from TED telling me to stay on topic. I really can't, so if I am not allowed on here anymore, I'm not allowed on here anymore. However, if it can be thought of in a meta way, then I guess I could be on topic, but I am not sure that this is possible. Anyway, this is what I am going to say. I will be a stick in the mud. I'm sorry, but this is how it must be. If you cannot believe in God from the fact that there is a Bible, then you cannot believe in God. The Bible is sufficient for anyone who wants to believe. If the Bible says that God causes lightning, then God causes lightning. The Bible is all I need. You see, God is very wise; infinitely wise, as a matter of fact. He has put everything we need to know about Him in one place, the Bible. I don't need to go out of what He has revealed. There is no other book like the Bible. None. All others fail. So, as you can see, I will be a stick in the mud, or, maybe mud around the stick. Either way, I am not going to budge, or allow that there is anything other necessary for belief than the Bible.

        • Tony Burbank

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          Jan 3 2013: "The bible is here so it must be true, right? it was written by people 2000 years who have an amount of knowledge that doesn't even come close to the people of today. God is so wise that he loves everyone except for the majority of the planet. God wants people to go to heaven but they can only go if they are christian. Obviously he wants people to be christian but the only way he converts them is through a book 2000 years ago that has plenty of flaws and has many instances of acts that go against today's ethical standards.

          Actually there are plenty of books like the bible every religion has one, I'm sure you haven't read any of them because your parents/priest told you that the bible was 100 percent correct. So you have no right to say that they are wrong. I on the other hand ask for proof and when they ( and you) are not able to produce it, then I have the right to call them wrong.

          And finally, you are a stick in the mud, congratulations, you are as stubborn as I first thought. I consider myself to be an open minded person but listening to you claim that the bible is true because you believe it shows why you should not be allowed to argue about religion. So there, you are a stick in the mud but being stubborn is not something to be proud of.

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        • Alexandre Anoutchine

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          Jan 3 2013: If you do not know I would like to say to you that there are several big religions in the world and each one was inspired by God. Every religion excludes the possibility of going to heaven for the people who do not follow it. In case God exists the chances are rather small that you believe in the right one, so good luck with it.

          On the other hand TED is not certainly for the religion related topics and i absolutely agree with it.

    • Alexandre Anoutchine

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      Dec 30 2012: It is easier to believe than to accept the truth. Accepting the truth requires thinking while believing requires only to have an opinion!

      • richard louis

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        Dec 31 2012: Wow. What a statement. It is easier to believe than to accept the truth. I'm sorry you don't believe the truth is the truth. And, yes, I would agree with you, to an extent, that accepting the truth requires thinking. If you think you got here by chance, though, you believe something that is impossible. The odds are more likely that a monkey could type out one of Shakespeare's entire plays if he had and infinite time to do it in; and, by the way, he couldn't, even then.

      • richard louis

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        Dec 31 2012: The fact that 40 different men wrote the Bible, and there are no contradictions, is amazing to me. The Bible is a book of complete harmony, though the authors did not necessarily know one another. Also, the authors were everything from kings to fishermen. I just happen to believe that the account of Jesus of Nazareth is true. I don't know if you believe Plato existed, or that he wrote certain things, but if you do, you didn't do a scientific experiment to come to that conclusion. There are various ways to look for facts. Archaeology, for example, has never disproven anything the Bible says, but many things it says have been proven by archaeology. To ignore this testimony is to want to remain in the dark. There is an article titled, The Dawkins Confusion. The site for it is http://www.booksandculture.com/articles/2007/marapr/1.21.html
        I am in agreement with what it says. You will find what you are looking for. I just hope you start looking for the truth.

        • Tony Burbank

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          Dec 31 2012: A blatantly obvious contradiction in the bible comes from the ten commandments. One of the rules that all men are to follow is "Thou Shalt Not kill" but I guess that the other authors didn't get the memo. If I'm not mistaken the bible is full of murder and killings. Also, the fact that a book is completely harmonious within itself (I'm not saying that the bible is) doesn't make it true.

          About the validity of Plato and Jesus, All we have heard about Jesus is hear say from Jewish people who had been waiting for a messiah. Plato on the other hand is talked about in numerous accounts and we see his legacy and many of his works. To be specific, 26 dialogues by Plato, not including his book "The Republic" and he was the founder of the Academy of Athens.

          In the comment above this you continue to say "I'm sorry you don't believe the truth is the truth" Well you still haven't provided any reason that we should. You also said that "If you think you got here by chance, though, you believe something that is impossible" yet in the next sentence you talk about the odds and say that it is possible. I'm not really sure where you are getting your stats from too because I feel like you pulled them out of thin air.

          Lastly, in a sense you could conclude that a monkey did type out one of Shakespeare's entire plays; Shakespeare. Monkeys don't live for an infinite amount of time so they pass on themselves through reproduction. Science very well proves evolution and the only people who don't believe it don't understand it. Eventually that monkey had many kids and grand kids and so forth until they eventually evolved into Homo sapiens. Homo sapiens then learned languages and sciences until they could write works of art and explain their world. Eventually, monkeys did write Shakespeare.

        • Zaahied Sallie

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          Jan 22 2013: Peace bro. No doubt that you are a sincere Christian but your statement that the Bible have no contradictions is erroneous. There are in fact many contradictions and conflicts in the Bible. This is a fact agreed even by the most staunch evangelists. Their argument is that the original signature book is inerrant and only the translations which have mistakes. How can they know this if they haven't seen or know what the book contained.

          A few examples from the Gospels never-mind the rest of the Bible:
          The Gospel of Matthew's account of the story of the temptation of Jesus is different to the Gospel of Luke. Mark 6 & 8 is different to Luke 9. Both Gospels cites the same story of what Jesus said must be taken on the journey. Matthew Chapter 27 v34 vs Mark chapter 15 v23 cites the story of wine given to Jesus. Matthew says that vinegar was added to the wine and Mark says that the wine was sweetened. Luke chapter 11 and Matthew chapter 6 is the famous Lord's prayer which is said to have been given by Jesus but is different in wording. Matthew says 3 x 14 is 41 etc.

          Peace
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      Roy Bourque 20+

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      Jan 29 2013: Richard,
      They are listening to God, but not as you do. They are listening to what God's creation is saying to them. In the absence of science, there were witch hunts. In the absence of science, there were rituals that produced very little fruit. In the absence of science, there was poverty, hunger, and disease with no understanding of why it was so. Science changed all that.

      Just about everything you do, aside from your religious practice, is conditioned or controlled by science.

      Your religion says thou shalt not judge, and yet you put the strongest judgment you could make "eternal damnation" to those who believe in science. Are you listening to your God, or are you just saying what you think your God would say based on what you were taught? Your God says that love is the greatest gift. I don't see where love and condemnation fit into the same sentence.

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