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Curious AboutLife

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What do you think of the idea of mind over matter?

What if I told you that science is proving the things that the "ancients" said where possible. the ability to change our surroundings with thought alone, healing the sick with our energy. Souls, life after death, the ability to tap into untapped mental/spiritual potential. Like pre-cog, and empathy. Noetic science has weighed the "human soul", while Noetic science and bio-field research have started studying human consciousness and energy fields. Where as before many thought these as fairy tales, and fantasy, made only for things such as Star Wars and Star Treck, or religion, which tells stories of healing the sick with the mind, and things spoken into existence. Can we really do it? Now science is going about to prove these questions.
So what do you think? Possible, but improbable? Or probable, but impossible.

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  • Dec 4 2012: “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God and the Word was God.” In the original Greek manuscript, the word for Word was the Greek word Logos, which means much more than “word.” The Logos is defined by philosophers and theologians as the rational principle that governs and develops the universe. So, information/mind comes first, but it's difficult to avoid ambiguity here; there is no clear definition of mind or matter. And it's our human logical mind that needs something to be prior to everything that fallows. In timeless continuum causality shatters, mind and matter are one.
    'Mind and matter are not separate substances. Rather, they are different aspects of our whole and unbroken movement.”
    It's the way David Bohm put it and i think truth is somewhere there .
    There is a Zen koan that illustrates the point :Is it the wind moving or is it the flag? The monk answers, neither, its your mind that is moving.
    It's what i think, thanks for asking ! :)
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      Dec 5 2012: "Is it the wind moving or is it the flag? The monk answers, neither, its your mind that is moving."

      I agree: We do live in a mental universe, and the movement of the flag by the force of the wind can be controlled by mind.

      Until mind intrudes, however, the wind behaves according to its windness, just as the wave according to its waveness, and light according to its lightness, which is to carry out its nature as defined by the divine principle of its nature--"this far and no farther."

      Behind it all--the physical, material universe--resides another, an unseen, matrix of a sort, that gives life and intelligence to the seen, directing it according to its predetermined nature.

      Since all is tributary to Mind--despite a thing's predetermined nature--water can be turned to wine, the winds can be commanded to "be still," the sick can be made whole, and the dead awaken from their sleep of death.
      • Dec 5 2012: "We do live in a mental universe."

        Agreed, it's what our mind can tell us, but let's make a leap : we are the Universe.
        It's not just words, somehow i do ' understand ' it ( Sufi had a word that can be translated into English as ' standunder ' , it's much closer to what i have ), but it's hard to tell. Actually, it sounds wired , because it's so familiar . Would you agree that we are not in crisis as media put it, but we are crisis ? In QM each process is a part of the Whole and is the Whole. Holographic principle, Mandelbrot set tell the same story by different ways. " God is within " - what is it about ? All information is here , if it is not here it is nowhere else.
        It's not the problem to figure it out, the problem is to feel/ be the universe the Whole ...God. Is it possible ? Yes, it is, but "it cost you not less than everything" ( T. S. Eliot )
        Ego keeps us inside, not matter ( nobody knows what matter is, it's magic :) if not ego we are out...
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      Dec 7 2012: Nice poetic creation mythlogy.

      Which contrdicts itself in ch 2

      Not sure why you would take the bible as an authority.

      Do you also take the parts that tell you to kill homosexuals and adulterers.

      Do you also take the parts that endorse slavery and genocide.

      Or do you pick and choose?
      • Dec 8 2012: Hi, Obey !
        I am not religious and don't take bible as an authority; it's a source of information among many others and it's great !
        Try to read the bible with unfocused mind , let your intuition connect the dots and test it against your direct experience and yes, science.
        People who use the Bible ( or Koran ) to justify slavery genocide and killing anyone ( homosexuals included ) have their personal agenda or simply didn't get the message.

        Btw. thanks for ' Nice poetic creation mythlogy." comment , you are kind !
        Thank you !
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          Dec 11 2012: Hi Natasha,

          The bible has some amazing poetry and stories even when translated to English. Its an important cultural document.

          There are many ways to read it or other texts. The literal word of god. A historical and cultural relic. Or to make intuition connections with your world view.

          I'm sure people reading it can come up with all sorts of insights. Many of them conflicting. Intuition can lead to insights, or profound moments of realisation. We love making connections. And if yours are different to others, it is hard to differentiate between the subjective interpretations.

          What we do know is contradictory claims can not all be correct.

          Everyone is welcome to their subjective intuitive dot joining. But if you want to have a discussion about what is , verifiable or correct, we need a different or follow on approach.

          By the way I've read it cover to cover in many different mind sets. These days i see it as a diverse collection of books by many human authors, with creation and cultural mythology etc related to the god of one small human tribe in the of. A god that is cruel, evil even, killing everyone, jealous, a murder. And fortunately, probably completely man made.
      • Dec 12 2012: Hi, Obey !
        ".... completely man made "
        What is not ? :)
        That is the key question, actually. You believe that there is ' objective reality' , which is out there ( correct me if i am wrong ) I believe, that the border between 'out there' and 'in here' is a persistent illusion of a human mind. It doesn't mean that i don't inhabit it :)
        " Never assume the obvious is true " What you perceive, your observations, feelings, interpretations, are all your truths. Your truth is important. Yet it is not The Truth. You can find the Truth if you are all out, but there will be no 'you ' to get it.
        I know, it doesn't sound persuasive and it shouldn't .
        " Ask and ye shall find "

        Best to you !
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          Dec 14 2012: Hi Natasha,

          Hmm objective reality. Its a tough one because we need to process it ultimately through our senses and minds, even with the aid of technology.

          Let me put it this way, there are things we can reliably verify within human limitations, and things, ideas, or undreamed of real or imagined things that we have not or currently can not verify one way other.

          As long as we are open about and distinguish between what is humanly reasonably verifiable and what isn't. Just because we don't know anything absolutely, we don't need to assume all claims are equal. But agree we are often limited by our paradigms.

          BTW I have changed my views on many things, or refined them while arguing a current position, but s a balancing act to get the right balance between open minded and having a best guess.

          Thanks for discussion.

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