David Hamilton

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Code Pink Peace Delegation to Pakistan

Okay, first off... This is mostly a shameless plug. I saw this organization on CNN this morning, and I thought it was the single coolest thing any Americans were doing to fight drone strikes in Pakistan. If you haven't seen this organization before, and you care about this issue, I highly reccomend supporting them...

http://www.codepink4peace.org/article.php?id=6174

It's an insanely naive and hippie oriented idea, but I absolutely love that a group of Americans went to Pakistan to fight drone strikes. It's the right thing to do... and they are definately going to bring some attention to the issue.

That said... Just to be me... The alpha male is screaming out "Really? Is that the new thing? Am I really going to just be wearing pink 24/7 because I want to support responsible moral causes?" Couldn't it have been Code Green?

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    Oct 24 2012: Just as a matter of interest ... do you think that the Pakistanies have any respect for these people? This is a propaganda coop for the terrorist groups. The Americans are still non-believers and now are laughed at for being trators to their country.

    Do you think that Jane Fonda is respected by the North Vietnamese. No she was a political tool to break the moral of the American fighting men. In other generations and certainly other countries she would have been tried and shot.

    Drones are a effective tool in the effort to which there is little or no defense. The "enemy" wishes it to be discontinued because it is a effective weapon. The only thing that has occured here is that these people who participate have placed themselves on a watch list of subversive individuals to the safe and secure operation of the country. Radical behavior always raises the red flag and is always documented.

    I do agree with you it is a insanely naive and hippie oriented idea. As states under your photo ... a foolish solution.

    All the best David .... Bob.
    • Oct 24 2012: The Taliban and their supporters are few in number, most Pakistanis who oppose the drones oppose them because they see it as a violation of Pakistani sovereignty and "honor", it makes their coountry look weak and they hate that. Even it was China or Russia sending the drones they'd hate it, but with Israel's number 1 ally doing it it becomes even more embarassing for them. The world isn't as simple as "us vs. the terrorists". Once upon a time Pakistan had a nuclear standoff with India and it could hold its own against India by conventional means too, now it's a failed state that has to negotiate with the Taliban out of weakness, many Pakistanis are very much ashamed of this, they cling to religion and believe in conspiracy theories that blame America, India, secular/liberal Pakistanis and the Jews for Pakistan's downfall, in this they are not so different from many Americans and Arabs.
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      Oct 24 2012: The drone strikes have been incredibly effective, they are the best recruitment tool terrorists have ever had. They get depressed 18 year old single men, who lost someone in a drone strike to join them. If you want an entire generation of world citizens to unite against America... Keep killing people at random with flying killer robots. 97% of people killed in drone strikes are not identified terrorists.

      In your first question... You prove that you barely deserve the right to speak... "do the pakistani's have any respect for these people"?... The Pakistani's... Are they just a uniform block? Like American's, we're all the same, just a uniform block of patriotic red neck christian gun nuts who don't like book learnin. Some people in Pakistan respect these people. Some do not. Some Americans respect them, some do not. Some people have respect for human life... Some do not.
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        Oct 25 2012: David, ... barely deserve the right to speak??? .. officially Pakistan is The Islamic Republic of Pakistan. The Islamic view of non-believers is hardly hidden as I am sure that you know.

        The United States' strained relationship with Pakistan has grown more tense after 50 influential imams and religious leaders there threatened a jihad against the U.S.

        I understand the conflict of the Americans controlling the drones in Pakistani airspace and that continues to be a problem. The US is not operating without permission but the Pakistans want control understandably.

        With a strong diplomatic corps and a willing administration this may not have come to this pivital point. In a failed government the religion usually become the default leader. Such I believe is the case here.

        I believe that religion is the best recruitment tool for the terrorists.

        We have agreed and disagreed in the past but have always had a open and informative discussion on all issues. You appear to be more passionate about this as the whole last paragraph was a emotional argument. Most unlike you.

        Best wishes ..... Bob.
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          Oct 25 2012: No... It is not an emotional argument... I said you barely deserve the right to speak for a very important reason. Most countries, have outlawed hate speech, we have not. I am a fan of freedom of speech, but I still find what you said on this topic absolutely disgusting, racist, islamaphobic or whatever the pc bs word is nowadays, etc.

          Most people in this country, believe in a version of christianity, which suggests that every Islamic man and woman will burn in hell. People hate each other because of insane fairy tales, and it's depressing, and disgusting, and embarassing... How old are you, that you still believe everyone in Pakistan, is the exact same stereotype? That's sad, and it's getting people in this country killed because you still think this way.

          I don't think you mean to disrespect millions of people who have operated under tyranny for thousands of years. That is what you are doing though, so while I agree with you on other issues... I want to be very clear, this is the kind of "us vs them" thinking, that is destroying the planet, and there is no excuse for someone who has come of age, to continue to perpetrate this nonsense.

          It's not an emotional issue, it's a rational one. If people who think like this take control of our government again, you will enter this nation into a holy war, it does not want, and it will lose. More United States soldiers have killed themselves, than were killed by the enemy... Your children are setting themselves on fire Robert... It is not a laughing matter.
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        Oct 25 2012: David, You make assumptions and assign titles and thoughts to me that I find objectionable. I ask that you not assign labels to me because I disagree with you.

        Perhaps we shall find grounds on a more agreeable subject to continue the fruitful discussions we have enjoyed in the past.

        I wish you well. Bob.
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          Oct 27 2012: I'm glad you find my opinion of your thoughts objectionable.

          I find what you have said here to be the epitomy of evil, and absolutely disturbing. I don't know how you can live with yourself after expressing such horrific thoughts. The soldiers of the nation you once loved are killing themselves rather than fighting this insane war... But you think there are more enemies out there you can send them to kill, for dumber reasons... It's disgusting.
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        Oct 28 2012: Again you assign words and thoughts to me that are not mine.
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          Oct 28 2012: "do you think that the Pakistanies have any respect for these people? This is a propaganda coop for the terrorist groups. The Americans are still non-believers and now are laughed at for being trators to their country."

          The misrepresentation of an entire nation of people, based on the idea that they all support the terrorist.

          "Do you think that Jane Fonda is respected by the North Vietnamese. No she was a political tool to break the moral of the American fighting men"

          I understand what you are saying here, and there is truth in it, but... again, all of the North Vietnamese are a uniform block... Really? You don't think some people, regular joes trying to work a job, thought it was a nice gesture of peace? People are people Bob.

          "Drones are a effective tool in the effort to which there is little or no defense. The "enemy" wishes it to be discontinued because it is a effective weapon."

          Less than 4% of the people killed by drones are identified terror suspects... 18 year old boys, are being trained to operate flying killer robots, by computer game... They are then blowing their own brains out in record numbers. This is the least effective, and most disgusting thing human beings have ever done in a war, and the people protesting it, are not our enemy.

          "officially Pakistan is The Islamic Republic of Pakistan. The Islamic view of non-believers is hardly hidden as I am sure that you know.

          The United States' strained relationship with Pakistan has grown more tense after 50 influential imams and religious leaders there threatened a jihad against the U.S."

          Again, all the Pakistani people are the same to you... We have killed hundreds of thousands of muslims who had nothing to do with 9/11... Who is declaring a jihad?

          "I believe that religion is the best recruitment tool for the terrorists"

          I assure you that the bodies of your family members, would make better motivation for you, than any book. This is not misrepresentation, i hope you change your mind.
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    Oct 24 2012: Pink? Absolutely a No No for me!
    But Code Pink is an organisation for women; and as you have rightly stated, the effort is laudable.
    For these group of passionate and exemplary women it is not just about wearing pink, but about taking action.
    Yes David; you can start something similar; and choose an alpha male colour for the awareness.
  • Oct 24 2012: I think Americans should be very careful with such actions, otherwise they risk emulating the arrogance of the American government. How do you know you're doing the Pakistanis a favor? How do you know the people living in the tribal areas don't favor American drones (it's a public secret the Pakistani government gives permission) over Pakistani air force and artillery bombardments? How do you know the Pakistanis opposed to the program (favoring Pakistani conventional military action or ceding land to the Taliban) aren't just nationalistic armchair generals who live in areas where they a) don't have to put up with the Taliban, b) never witnessed a Pakistani military offensive and c) don't live in the big cities where Taliban bombings kill scores of civilians every other day, in other words the same Pakistani armchair generals who thought it was a good idea have a nuclear standoff and cold war with the far larger and more powerful India and to cede parts of Pakistan and Afghanistan to the Taliban and Al-Qaida (precisely the kind of imperialism they accuse the Americans of) in exchange for these groups harassing India?
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    Oct 24 2012: Hi David, I have not heard of this before. It is a courageous endeavor undertaken by these people!
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    Oct 9 2012: It's too late Dave,the Poms have given the go ahead for drone use by the police in the UK,it's just one step towards it being adopted by other countries.
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      Oct 9 2012: I know. Still, this protest took guts, it was creative, and it's in the true spirit of the American people. You may all be following our politicians down the rabbit hole... but the American people still aren't really convinced of the whole "teenagers playing video games that operate flying killer robots, to kill other teenagers" thing, yet.

      I would not be entirely surprised if soon we're the only country that doesn't let them on our soil... despite selling them to everyone else. Hypocrisy ftw. That seems like a naive dream though, they're already flying around.

      Even if we're all going this way, it's horrible, and these women spent some money, and did something creative, that got on TV for the cause... Respect.