- Arthur McQueen
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Atheism: why do people don't believe in God?
My question to all atheists is that, why don't they believe in God? Can't they see His signs and can everything that happens on Earth happen by chance? If I don't believe in Allah, Jesus, Buddha or any other God, how can I live? I'll have no direction or paths.
Ok. I agree. There are somethings that we don't know about God, i.e. where did he came from but I believe there is a difference between the knowledge he possesses and we possess. If we'll get all that knowledge, what will be the difference between Him and us? There are numerous points where his knowledge is way better than ours.
If I don't believe in any God, then (I suppose) we are saying that everything that happens, happens by chance. What will be the purpose of living then? Other than living for the betterment of the people, is there any other reason for living? We already live in such chaotic conditions, so isn't it better to die in this case?
Now, I am not trying to hurt anyone's feelings (and if I have done that, I apologize from the depths of my heart) nor am I saying that atheists should die or have no reasons to live but I still find it difficult to NOT believe in God. Thank you.
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Adriaan Braam 20+
TheGodGuy has a blog and one title is: "Emanuel Swedenborg: The perfect theologian for atheists and scientists." (Emanuel was a much respected scientist himself).
That post starts like this:
"ONE of the big issues atheists have against religion is that many of the stories in the Holy Bible seem irrational and do not stand up to either scientific scrutiny or today’s enlightened sociological sensitivities. However, having been a scientist himself, Emanuel Swedenborg’s contribution to theology was unparalleled in allowing the human understanding to probe rationally, and even scientifically, the 'mysteries' of faith."
This blog post is not too long, and may be found interesting.
http://thegodguy.wordpress.com/2011/01/21/emanuel-swedenborg-the-perfect-theologian-for-atheists-and-scientists/
Gabo Moreno 100+
Come on! Next the ten spirits of Sanskrit hidden in my letter soup. They truly reveal divine existence and infinities within the finite soup. All at the quantum level when it crosses with m-theory and you understand that branes sound a lot like brains thus the cosmological unavoidable existence of The God (TM). Hey I am A Scientist too! So you have no option but believe me.
Meh.
Adriaan Braam 20+
Just one thing though, we do not accept and believe what Swedenborg wrote because he was (only) a scientist, sorry.
He was (Wikipedia) "also a prophet, philosopher, theologian, revelator, and, in the eyes of some, Christian mystic."
Gabo Moreno 100+
Linda Taylor 50+
You forget, it is not just the Christian Bible, but the Vedas, the Quran, the Analects, the Tanakh etc.that are looked at the same way. The stories are interesting, the parables applicable, each of them an acceptable way to walk in the world. But atheists do not literally believe in any of them. We do not choose one and run with it. They are all excellent books with many lessons just as there are many others. We just do not run around saying I am right and you are wrong.
And you have got to stop looking at one website and thinking that that represents all thought on the matter. That's like looking up feminist and thinking all are the same.
Adriaan Braam 20+
--" Like they are the only religion that believes in a god or something."-- You've never seen me type that. Anyone that believes in a higher power, or anything beyond matter is fine with me. No one is perfect and neither is any religion. It is just that I'm somewhat familiar with the Bible and its internal meaning.
--"We just do not run around saying I am right and you are wrong."--
Somehow I do seem to get that message. When I give my view and opion it is purely on the bases of "take it or leave it", in fact I often compare it to feeding birds. I put it out, and that's it.
My religion helped me very much and I want to give everyone a chance to have the same benefit.
Linda Taylor 50+
"many Atheists do not believe in a God because they reject the traditional Christian belief"
I am refuting that statement. It is simply not true.
Linda Taylor 50+
Just because I took some literary license does not make his argument correct. I still stand by my statement and he has not challenged that. Only that he did not type that stuff.
Adriaan Braam 20+
"But atheists do not literally believe in any of them." Neither do I take the Bible only literally.
"We just do not run around saying I am right and you are wrong." Neither do I. In fact, during the many discussions over the years I very often agreed with Athists about the interpretation of the literal text of the Bible.
"And you have got to stop looking at one website and thinking that that represents all thought on the matter." What makes you think I am looking at just one website??
"Only that he did not type that stuff." Where does this apply too??
Have a good night
Linda Taylor 50+
Gabo countered your premise by attacking the lack of validity of the website and establishing that it lacked any credentials.
I brought you back to your major premise and countered that the problem was not just in the website and cautioned against creating an argument based on a single website. The problem was in the premise. That perhaps Atheists not only reject the "traditional Christian belief" but also many other beliefs based on some omnipotent being(s). That belief in said being(s) creates an 'I am right, you are wrong' view of the world. However, many atheists while still respect these works for what they bring to humanity. (This is a little out of order because I have to keep scrolling up so forgive the technicality).
You pointed out that I was technically incorrect. That you did not type those words that were an elaboration on my part (" 'Like they are the only religion that believes in a god or something.'-- You've never seen me type that."). And you mentioned that you do not set up an "I am right and you are wrong" scenario. I agreed that you did not type that but disagreed with your right/wrong statement which was outlined in your premise "many Atheists do not believe in a God because they reject the traditional Christian belief." You did not say that Atheists believe differently than Christians. You did not say that Atheists reject traditional Hindu beliefs. You said Atheists reject Christian beliefs. Your beliefs. In other words, you are right and Atheists reject it.
I said that was not true.
Then Don congratulated you and I asked for what.
I hope that you can follow your debate now. I outlined it as clearly as I could.
Adriaan Braam 20+
It seems that you took text out of what I first wrote and build up ideas and thoughts regarding a premise of mine.
These are my words:
--"Through many discussions I got the impression that many Atheists do not believe in a God because they reject the traditional Christian belief and 'understanding' of God."
Could an impression be regarded as a premise?
I think I even said somewhere that I, also, do not agree with the traditional Christian belief and their understanding of God.
So I'm not very sure where you want to go with all this, but thanks for your attention
BTW the Atheist website that I was contributing to was started in Britain and grew into the States and Canada. It was started through a bus add campaign. http://atheistbus.ca/ has gone through some changes but the one that runs it is Chris. He even sent me a note asking me to come back and participate again.
Linda Taylor 50+
I outlined how I arrived at the conclusion. I did not create ideas and thoughts out of some text.
Adriaan Braam 20+
This ended close to three years ago because of organizing our son's wedding, and I may have saved some text somewhere but am not sure.
Gabo Moreno 100+
So, I agree with Linda, your statement about "Christian beliefs," is wrong. We reject many other beliefs, not just the Christian's.
Yet, I centred into your link because it was just outrageous. I detest how easily people are lured in by snake-oil salesmanship, and can't recognize it for what it is. So I have very little patience towards it.
Colleen Steen 500+
Very interesting that some folks see this discussion as a "win". That means that s/he must also perceive a loser? HMMM.....I thought TED was about sharing ideas! I didn't know it was a contest!
EDIT -
Adriaan, regarding your recent comment below.
Apparently your cheering squad does not share the same perspective.
Adriaan Braam 20+
"When I give my view and opinion it is purely on the bases of "take it or leave it", in fact I often compare it to feeding birds. I put it out, and that's it."
It certainly is not about winning anything or saying "you are wrong and I am right" There is nothing more important in human life than freedom. It is the freedom to love, or believe, anything we want which makes us human.