- Marija Kovačević
- Hrvatska Kostajnica
- Croatia
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Modern day propaganda
While searching for ex-Yu propaganda posters, I couldn't help but wonder-...
Are we nowdays subject to more subtile form of propaganda?
Is it coming from corporations or governments, or can we even make a difference between the two?
Where in the World are the people more influenced by it?
Is it the "free" West, or communist countries, or maybe states with non secular governments?
Rick Ryan 10+
In an environment where the population has access to opposing information about the propaganda content, it is only as effective as the target(s) in the population is/are willing to take the information at face-value without using alternate information sources and critical thinking to assess the validity of the propaganda being presented. Sadly, even in my own country (U.S.), too many people don't take advantage of that ability. And that applies to not only economic marketing, but also governmental politics. I am guilty of accepting the belief that if I don't buy a certain "Corporate America" produced product I will never have enjoyable sexual relations again during the rest of my life. I am just as guilty if I don't think any politician is trustful or competant just because all political candidates will generally only try to convince me the opposition is a moron while they themselves are your only savior. Critical thinking would force me to believe that can't be true, because ANY person who decided to be a politician would immediately be labeled by the opposition as a moron. If I believed that ALL people were morons, then NOBODY would be qualified to "politic"...even the people in the general public who are complaining about "all politicians" (or "all corporate leaders").
Ken brown 30+
Random Chance 30+
If however, one is able to grasp the truth about being lied to,
the second main effect is a dulled ability to act on what one now knows is the truth.
So, even though "we know we are being lied to and have been since we were born",
we still are not taking the proper and vigorous action needed to stop what is going on.
In my opinion it is all leaders be they military, government, educational, religious, political, and just about anyone who is in a position where they need people to believe in them for their continued paycheck rather then they believe in me or us, because clearly they don't when it comes to the environment, mental and physical health, morals or any other thing.
I don't trust nor believe anyone who doesn't do what they say and none of those I listed ever do. In fact, they never have in my entire life.
My bank moved the cameras from the ceiling to the counter right in front of customers where they can then scan the retinas without permission or customer knowledge.
They have continually said that they safe-guard your personal information and virtually all important databases under their protection have been hacked into. IF by chance, your identity is stolen, you have to prove who you are instead of them paying for what they have done. They are never responsible but you are. The list could go on and on. Most Russians just want to live lives of peace, have families, go boating, kite flying, build something, play and so on. Imagine my surprise when I discovered this and how it contrasted with what I was raised with on a daily basis - they all want to kill me because I'm American. You can go from so-called trivial propaganda (there is none) to serious stuff. Let go of all, old ideas absolutely. They are, were and continue to be, lies. It is called deception, which is the active, misrepresentation of reality to anothers conscious mind.
False is held in the conscious mind. Think about it.
David Hamilton 50+
Mitch SMith 50+
It is not by our pathetic naked vulnerable bodies - no fur, no claws, no teath, no venom.
It is by our community that our power is exponential.
Every animal must sense its environment and act in order to survive.
Each organism strives for sufficient advantage to persist from one moment to the next.
Each organism will have a field of agency defined by its senses and capacities built-in to its body.
From that field of agency, it has options of advantage to choose from for best advantage.
A solitary animal is chained to its senses - what lies beyond them can be guessed at by personal experience - but this does not extend the field of agency very far.
Then we have the human.
A human can communicate its filed of agency to other humans.
The resulting multiplication of the field of agency is enormous.
No other organism (we know of) has such a potential.
While ever this enormous field of agency is turned to the advantage of the community, it cannot be beaten.
However, the field of agency is not all to the advantage of the community.
Choices can be made to harm the community.
Very specific choices can be made to direct the community advantage to an individual, or a group of individuals at the cost of the community.
Communications designed to re-direct community agency to the advantage of individuals or groups of individuals is propaganda.
The hallmark of propaganda is teh closed-system.
The community advantage operates in the open system of the environment - where our advantage is turned to prevent predation and competition from other species and gain sufficient balance to survive.
The most simplistic closed system is "us and them" - where "them" becomes another part of the community - not another species.
Such involution of our advantage is the evidence of system closure.
Money is another such closure - no one pays the environment, and all advantage is directed to the currency issuer.
Same with "information".
All require propaganda.
Scott Koenraadt
From what I noticed is the Americans are particularily skilled at with, with the most obvious being their movies and how they are always the hero, most honourable, never backing down, etc.
In Canada (where I live) it is a bit more subtle, it is ingrained into even our beer commercials (particularily Molson Canadian) where they define what 'Canadian' is and what the Canadian experience is.
elizabeth muncey 10+
Ken brown 30+
From a Croatian perspective could you give us some examples where you see this in the west or even Eastern Europe.
Marija Kovačević
Our media don't judge US invading other countries, they call people protesting on wallstreet hippies, and we are apparently "Friends of Syria".
And if you disagree, you must be some kind of extremist.
I feel I'm not getting the whole picture, and I want to. Think about all the people who don't even question! Who and what do they vote for? Do they even know?
Ken brown 30+
http://www.somberi.com/index.php
Gail . 50+
Propaganda is a way of turning your head away from truth because it pulls at your emotional strings - usually fear.
Ed Schulte 50+
I don't know any of those references. :-)
Robert Winner 50+
Given the right to see what the agency has under your name I could tell you almost everything about you that you keep personal and that which is public.
Governments have the same capabilities to gather the data but why should they when it is already compiled.
Corporations gather data to analyze potential markets. It is not magic that McDonalds, Wendys, sears, etc .... build in a specific area. They collected data about municipal growth and bought land years ago.
In Europe I must handover my passport at the desk when checking into a hotel. I am on camera all over Europe. My location can be pinpointed within hours (or less).
With the advent of computers this information can be made available almost upon demand to anyone. Type your name in the computer and it will spit out iinfo on you .... did you give this info to be spread. If I desired I could find where you live, phone number, and same for your children (if any) . Do yours, do a friend ....
scarry isn't it.
All the best. Bob.
Marija Kovačević
OK, now on a more serious side, yes, I am aware of all the things you mention. But on the other hand, as long as I know I'm being sold something, I can make a choice.
I'm worried about some information I take for granted because it's presented as the ultimate truth. Just what I wrote to Pat, I don't care for McDonalds, I wouldn't eat there if they paid me to, I'm worried about someone telling me "keep calm and carry on" all the time.
Budimir Zdravkovic 20+
Robert Winner 50+
The "keep calm and carry on", guy is bad but the problem is the ones who buy into all the dreams and promises. I try to do the math, run the model, determine what the end objective is, and determine if it is a light at the end of the tunnel or an on comming train.
In countries around the world the politicians keep writing checks when the bank account is empty. In the US the administration as added 14 trillion to the national debit in two years and has stated that the cost next year will add another three trillion to the deficit. At what point should we hold "fisically stupid" people accountable. That he has done this is bad but that people still want him to retain office tells the real problem.
I do not have concerns for people like you who see and question. On the world scene the Euro countries who are broke (and refuse to change) are mad at Germany who is solvant for not "giving" them money. They spend on social program without the resources to support them. If it ain't comin in .. it can't go out. If I have been getting it for free I would not understand why I should work either.
I am sorry for this rant, but I get mad at people who not only drink the coolaide but go back for seconds. If it sounds to good to be true ... run at top speed.
Thanks for the reply. All the best. Bob.
pat gilbert 50+
I would ask where do you separate culture from propaganda? Reality can be defined as agreement, a culture can be defined as agreement.
One of the main tools of advertising is emotion. You would see marketing for a markets that you are not the demographic for, football or beer advertising, as silly but one that you are the demographic for will be the ones you might be less aware of .
A lot of it also has to with the emotional state of the individual. You would market differently to an angry demographic than a cheerful demographic.
I would Look at what you are being subjected to and try and discern what the advertisers intention is.
Marija Kovačević
Tthe situation we're in is much worse than just the ads on TV. The numbing of population is much more effective than raising emotions, because if people don't care, you don't have to persuade them that bombing another country is a good thing.
pat gilbert 50+
http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/en/dan_dennett_on_dangerous_memes.html
Ed Schulte 50+
Or the other side ...
they are aware they are bombing other with the "smart weapons&chemical weapons &nuclear weapons" and WE maintain "that it good because ...
"WE are 'the protector of good'...WE knew because WE are told by Media, Politicians, our Religious values, TV entertainment and Movie Entrainment...and they can't be wrong!!!!..so it is not only "good" it is THE ONLY way. and NO!! no one else can have "smart bombs" until we sell them to you of course!!
Your opening question was...
"Are we nowdays subject to more subtile form of propaganda? "
and to me the key world is "subtile" and the important of the question hinges on ....when are HUmans going to return to valuing Truth over dilution and delusion ...and why / what is it above the HUman lower mind functions that makes it so easy to fool.
And finally ...what would it be like if it were not so??
Feyisayo Anjorin 50+
I believe that propaganda has also evolved. It is used by democratic nations, communist nations, religious leaders(of nations), the media and companies.
Propaganda is like the same story translated to different languages, or the same story with different costumes for each different performance.
Marija Kovačević
Krisztián Pintér 200+
Imad Atwi 10+
The boundaries between all these sources are blurring as their business models evolve and interact with one another, thus making it much difficult to reveal the true source, with all the beneficiaries lurking around.
There is no geographical heat mapping to where people are most influenced by propaganda. And unfortunately education level is not really a good indicator either. They need to have a new KPI, which is called cognitive reasoning. Maybe then we can assess the situation better.
Propaganda exist both in the "free" countries as well as in "other" countries, just in different form. And I believe there isnt much of a different about the amount of people being influenced in either "worlds". Clever and successful propaganda adjust itself and its subtlety according to the subjects and context involved.
Marija Kovačević
Imad Atwi 10+
I will not blame the education system (as i've witnessed bigotry in all shapes and form, spanning from illiterates to PHD candidates).
My bet is on the upbringing of that person and the environment around him. Cognitive and rational thinking could never be overrated while growing up.
David Hamilton 50+
Fritzie Reisner 100+
Ed Schulte 50+
because this so-called "Information age" is numbing / Dumbing the general public with volume and Lack of Quality ( iow Truth) a publication "The Dumbing Up of America" might be of ref. for you.
Prehaps not where you are ,....but in North America .....the Media ...is based on "anything goes" ...and they are getting away with it.
On the WWW here, for example, only approx. 15% is actually accurate information ...
Marija Kovačević
Ed Schulte 50+
I don't know any of those references :-)
Gail . 50+
Marija Kovačević