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James Zhang

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Is it possible to create music without a beat or rhythm?

If I define music as the language of emotions through sounds, then what would "music" sound like if it had no beat or rhythm? And if it does need some sort of beat or rhythm, then why is it necessary to have a beat/rhythm to create music?

Topics: music music education
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    edward long 100+

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    Jul 30 2012: Most dictionaries (EVERY one I checked) say rhythm and/or beat are essential parts of music. You ask why? My guess is the life long dependence on repetitive, predictable, unchanging time sequencing of perceptible events is begun in the womb with the beating of Mom's heart.
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      James Zhang 30+

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      Jul 30 2012: Hmm... Beats and rhythm have correlation to our heart beat, you say. So then if a baby in the womb were to listen to rhythms and beat a lot, would the baby grow up to be a musical person?
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        edward long 100+

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        Jul 31 2012: I have no idea about that James. I do have an uneasy feeling about introducing excessive exposure to rhythms other than Mom's heart to the unborn. I think God's purposes and design are best left unaltered.
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          James Zhang 30+

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          Jul 31 2012: you're right, we don't want to overdo things to the point of damage
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      Lindsay Newland Bowker 50+

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      Jul 31 2012: Edward,

      Undeniably true especially in what we are taught and unaccustomed to in western music. Undeniably presnt in most indigenous music.

      Of course the natural rhythms of the heart and our breathing or even sounds we love to hear train our ear at least to look for and appreciate these repeating patterns..

      I grew up in a tradition of singing western classical music..mostly sacred music so it was quite a leap for me to "surrender" to the possibility that something could be "music" without rhythm. Now that I have allowed myself to do that, I find I have an aversion to repetitions that are two frequent or two simple or which stand out too much..even in classics like Beethoven's Ninth.
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        edward long 100+

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        Jul 31 2012: I recall one "musical" work which consisted of a solitary person sitting at a piano playing nothing for an hour, complete silence in the venue. The audience sat quietly while the "musician" turned blank page after blank page until finally standing to bow. I cannot find a published definition of the word "music" that does not mention rhythm and/or beat. I guess the common usage of the word has evolved but the dictionaries have not. I wonder what the definition of rhythmless music would be.
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          Lindsay Newland Bowker 50+

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          Jul 31 2012: That sounds like John Cage's famous work 4' 33" ( the duration of the piece

          http://www.sheetmusicplus.com/title/4-33/1008430

          The "music" was from the ambient noise in the room..people coughing, shuffling feet, giggling etc, in awkward response to the unexpected situation A lot of his later musical explorations were on this idea of ambient music. and about his exploration of silence in his spiritual journey.

          I always feel presumptuous interpreting John Cage for anyone else as he is so far beyond almost everyone else..ad therefore a stratosphere beyond my humble grasp but what I got about this phase of his music is that sounds around us all the time evoke emotion & memory and affect mood..which are the things we look to music to do.

          The sound of lapping water is just magical and hymnody to me restful and calming. What is Hayden Water Music about if not that? Thunder evokes edgy waiting for something .

          Doesn't music refer to these ambient sounds which evoke emotions and moods?

          If music imitating these sounds to evoke the mood of the "original" is music, isn't the thing itself also music if it the source of the connection between that sound and that emotional response expressed in the music?

          Isn't the form of music we prefer culturally determined by culture rather than determined by any universal or fixed idea of what is music and what is sound?
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        edward long 100+

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        Jul 31 2012: You make a forceful argument for rhythmless music, Lindsay. As an art visigoth I must not enter that part of the debate. I will watch from a semantic perspective on the sidelines to learn the new definition of the word "music".

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