This conversation is closed. Start a new conversation
or join one »
How to get rid of fear?
I'm not talking about phobias or individuals' fears. I'm talking about a society that has elevated fear as one of its prime guiding principles.
In the West, subjects are controlled by an unending stream of messages that induce fear - by a politics of fear. This turns us into weak, unfree, easily controllable slaves who kill their creative potential:
-you have to eat and be healthy, be scared of unhealthy food and health risks everywhere
-you have to fear foreigners
-you have to fear economic collapse, so give in to social injustice, it's for your own good (e.g. productivity went up 80% in the U.S. since 1973, whereas wages only went up 39%)
-fear your neighbor
-fear technology and science
-fear climate change (even though it may be real)
-etc...
How can we beat this dreadful politics of fear? Do we even have to? Or maybe this societal fear is useful? (It makes us productive and obedient slaves - which is good?)
Can and do we have to liberate ourselves? And how do we go about?
Comment deleted
Comment deleted
Colleen Steen 500+
If you have a source where tension is defined as awareness and caring, perhaps you can post it? I just checked several sources, and I'm finding a similar definition to what I already quoted, with even more fear based meanings. God doesn't bring me to conversations...I bring myself:>)
This is the debate, as you have guided it...tension is fear...how do we get rid of it?
Comment deleted
Colleen Steen 500+
You state..."I have yet to see anything that sounds like a debate around the central question raised by Laurens".
Did you look carefully through all the comments? I see lots of relevant information.
You recently wrote a comment saying..."Without tension there is no story to learn from".
So I'm adding the element of tension. How's it working for ya?
You also stated..."I knew it would get your attention and that pleases me".
Now that you have my attention, and I am providing you with tension, you tell me to "start your own argument, in your own conversation'!!!
You still have not posted a definition that includes awareness and caring, so I don't think/feel that is a valid meaning for tension.
Do you see any contradiction in your posts Don?
Comment deleted
Colleen Steen 500+
Absence of tension is a good thing. The topic discussion is "How to get rid of fear?" Tension is generally fear based, so I see no point in deliberately bringing tension into the conversation.
Definition of tension:
"The act or action of stretching or the condition or degree of being stretched to stiffness; tautness; stress; pressure; inner striving, unrest, or imbalance often with physiological indications of emotion; a state of latent hostility or opposition between individuals or groups".
Personally, I don't see any reason whatever to bring tension to a conversation, and yes Don, there are plenty of stories and learning WITHOUT tension.
Lack of disagreement does NOT "pretend all is well". Agreement is a foundation on which people can build, grow and evolve with the discussion. Try it...you might like it!
Comment deleted
Colleen Steen 500+
I've read through all the comments on the thread, and I believe there is some very valuable information here...to each his/her own! :>)
Brian R Light 10+
I just tried to get verification about what drives us from research on a brain injured man who lost his emotions that I heard about. I googled around and I can't get a fix (maybe an urban myth?) but no doubt brain injury can change everything about personality. In short, I disagree that people are one way or another. I feel we are all both and more (I won't hazard). I agree with what is needed though, (yes, for most everything). Seek balance.
Colleen Steen 500+
Brian R Light 10+
Colleen Steen 500+
I believe that some of us are emotionally driven creatures, some of us are logically driven creatures, and some of us have found the balance....just like what is needed for bull riding, and probably everything in our life experiences.....yes?
Brian R Light 10+
Comment deleted
Brian R Light 10+
Colleen Steen 500+
I don't think/feel we ever actually become "immune", and from my own experience, I know we can get to the point where we can detach from external influences enough to be confident with our own choices regarding fear. Knowledge is power. The more we know about ourselves, and the issues we are dealing with, the more we are able to stay with what is real and important to us as individuals. What do you think about that?
Sometimes, humor is a wonderful short circuit for fear!
"Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves for they shall never cease to be amused".
Comment deleted
Comment deleted
Comment deleted
Terry Haynes
Comment deleted
Terry Haynes
Jamie Lee Mcfadden
Comment deleted
Jamie Lee Mcfadden
Terry Haynes
Chris Kelly 20+
In religion, to "fear" the Lord thy God means 'to be in awe' of; to have 'extreme reverence' for.
This is different than being afraid ... which is what many people suffer from by their governing factor.
Your question seems to be about fear of success, which boils down to caring more about what other people think of us than what we think of ourselves.
This is easy to overcome once we realize it for what it is ... therefore reiterating the how important it is to "know thyself".
Fear is only as deep as the mind allows.
Japanese Proverb
Robert Winner 50+
Comment deleted
Lindsay Newland Bowker 50+
Adriaan Braam 20+
The first thing we learn as kids is to fear traffic. Does that mean we should never cross the street??
No, it means: don't be ignorant, look left, right and left again. Examine fear and use it to become better.
We should fear to hurt our partner, nothing wrong with that. This also is the whole concept behind 'the fear of God'
Frans Kellner 100+
To avoid danger and take precautions I wouldn't call fear, good nor bad. To me fear has no real object then the thoughts or feelings we're subjected to.
Fear mostly result from stories we;re told or tell ourselves.
Adriaan Braam 20+
Fear and anxiety are important to the well-being of human society. If mankind had no fears - physical, economic or social there would be no order and no being-useful. The fear of pain and disease is a force which compels many to care for their bodies and to live lifes that are at least externally in order. Anxiety for the necessaries of life drives many to do worthwhile work for the neighbor. Fear of the law and its penalties holds floods of evil in check; and fear for reputation moves countless people to give up part of their life in service to others. Without these basic fears, human society could not long exist.
Imagine there not being the fear of hights.. if it's there, I'd call it good.
natasha nikulina 50+
" Without these basic fears, human society could not long exist."
Just a little change makes this statement true to me :
With these basic fears, human society can not exist any longer .
Colleen Steen 500+
While I believe that fear gives us information, I do not agree that fear and anxiety are important to the well-being of human society in the way you describe. Wouldn't it be great if mankind (I assume you are talking about humankind?) could see the benefits of "order" without fear?
So far, fear of pain and disease has not been a very successful force which compels many to care for their bodies...especially in western cultures:>(
Fear of the law and penalties has not been very good about holding "floods of evil in check", and I don't percieve fear for reputation moving people to give up part of their life in service to others. The people I observe helping and serving others are doing it from love, rather than fear.
I think/feel humans could exist quite well without living a life of fear, and personally, I love to see people helping neighbors because of the joy of helping the neighbor, rather than from a place of anxiety and fear.
Frans Kellner 100+
My reply on your comment would be the exact same as Colleen's so I think love is the glue of mankind instead of fear.
If you want crime to get down we have to care more.
I don't know for sure but I think Swedenburgh will agree with me or I would much be disappointed.
Adriaan Braam 20+
I may have sounded too negative, sorry.
For one thing I am not talking about long days full of fear and anxiety. Just about the moments of possible second thoughts when deciding to (not) do something that may be not good.
We may have seen speeding cars slowing down on seeing a police cruiser, or heard of riots that took place when the police was not there or on strike.
Colleen
"So far, fear of pain and disease has not been a very successful force which compels many to care for their bodies...especially in western cultures:>("
Seems to me the many regulations related to labels and listing of ingredients is all about fear and the preventing of pain and disease. Nuts anyone? :)
Maybe the fast majority has no use for fear (anymore?) but we are not born as angels. Five minutes ago I offered someone a chocolate, she resisted because she said it would give her a headache.
I can't help but wonder what would happen if all public cameras were turned off and the government closed its prisons..
Frans
"If you want crime to get down we have to care more."
Any practical ideas? Give a free loan to someone that wants to rob a bank?
Swedenborg would, I believe, say that we all have free will and that no one is perfect. So we all make mistakes. Some people will need, and take, advice, others may also need restrains. It is never enough to just speak the words, "I love you, you are fine and I am fine," and leave it at that.
I believe we discipline our children because we love them. If not, we couldn't care less what they did.
Added-------------------
In this article it says "Fear is life acting to preserve itself." and then it says a lot more
http://www.swedenborgstudy.com/articles/evil/drs62.htm
Colleen Steen 500+
You write..."I may have sounded too negative, sorry".
Who are you saying "sorry" to? Yourself? Because it is your life, and the way you live it that you are talking about. If you are choosing to live a fear based life, it impacts you, and perhaps those around you.
You write..."Seems to me the many regulations related to labels and listing of ingredients is all about fear and the preventing of pain and disease".
I percieve the labeling on food items to be provided to give us information regarding what is in the product, so we can make informed choices. I don't percieve that as fear based.
You write..."
I can't help but wonder what would happen if all public cameras were turned off and the government closed its prisons".
Adriaan, we've had a similar discussion before....about someone watching us, or cameras watching us.
You apparently believe that people respond well to fear...if someone is watching us and there are ramifications, people will behave differently...better maybe? I do not agree that people respond well to fear based behaviors. Personally, I don't function well at all when someone tries to frighten me into submission, and I don't think most people do. Most people enjoy freedom of choice and the ability to make their own decisions without fear.
I agree that we "discipline our children because we love them", and I do not agree with your way of disciplining, as you have suggested on other sites. You advocate telling a child "obey me or else". I don't agree with that practice Adriaan because it disempowers people, starting from the time they are children.
Frans says..."If you want crime to get down we have to care more."
No Adriaan...that does not mean 'Give a free loan to someone that wants to rob a bank"
I believe, it means to empower people...genuinely care about people. You are absolutely right Adriaan... "It is never enough to just speak the words, "I love you, you are fine". It is important to be genuinely engaged without fear.
Frans Kellner 100+
The worst we can fear is fear itself for it prevents us from fully living and thereby from exploration and development.
To understand that death isn't the end of our existence but a transition to new experiences kills all and every fear.
To see this you need to trust life and see that time isn't real but only a way to measure movement.
So more knowledge will diminish overall fear and so why education is important to fight it while educators have to educate themselves to the point where they understand that living beings aren’t mere machines but a living, loving force condensed into matter instead of matter that accidentally came alive.
Yuri Gomez
Yes We can.. In order to liberate ourselves from that dreadful feeling; Yes We have to.
Fear is like a secondary effect of the inability to learn, and our inability to learn is because of fear. it's like a loop but it can be stopped. We have a choice on that.
Lindsay Newland Bowker 50+
how do we encourage others to seek freedom..to step outside of fear?
How do we grow the courage and wisdom in oursleves to do that?
Yuri Gomez
I see it this way!
Some people have realized that fear is a dreadful feeling, but they are doing nothing about it. here fear has become part of life that seems impossible to detach from.
Some others are looking a solution for it.
"be the change you want to see in the world" is enough to show others and to oneself that there exist other choices out there, that fear has not useful purpose. it's like a seed for change.. that's what I learned :>
usually fear is related with "something bad can happen", yes it could, but it could also not. the fear I mean here is when at the moment of thinking on "something bad can happen" is triggered instantaneously a dreadful feeling, that keeps us in the loop.
As kindly Coleen wrote above: Awareness is the first step toward change that way We will realize that being open to information is not as bad as it looks.
Colleen Steen 500+
I totally agree kind, wise Yuri...."be the change you want to see in the world"...preferably with an open heart and mind:>)
Colleen Steen 500+
"How do you overcome fear"
Thanks for the thumbs up and reminder OM K:>)
Colleen Steen
Feb 22 2012: I agree Heather, that we can sometimes convince ourselves that what we are feeling is excitment, rather than fear! Change our thinking, we change our feelings, and it may change our life experience:>)
When I started performing on stage professionally, I used to get wicked stage fright to the point of becoming physically ill. Once I was on stage and in character, it was totally gone, but before the performance started, it was horrible!
A wonderful director advised me that fear/stage fright was simply an energy moving through the body, and with different thoughts, we could transform the energy into something more positive. So, rather than thinking I was going to make a mistake...forget my lines...songs...blocking...etc., which was taking me into stage fright/fear, I started changing my thoughts to..."I can't wait to get out there and do what we've been rehearsing...I'm ready...prepared...and I will do the best I can with enthusiasm. It only took a couple times of changing my thinking before the stage fright disappeared, and was replaced with excited enthusiasm. Thanks for reminding me of this wonderful lesson from years ago:>)
Colleen Steen 500+
Fear can become a loop....a cycle... which creates, as Laurens says in the indroduction, a prime guiding principle in the life experience. The more we fear, the less willing we may be to open the heart and mind to information...the less information we have, the greater the fear.......and so it continues.........
I agree that we can only liberate ourselves, and that is a choice we make in each and every moment. Awareness is the first step toward change. Another step may be in knowing that learning, and being open to information is really enjoyable. I would not deny myself that opportunity:>)
Yuri Gomez
Colleen,
Yes it works :D.. When we are open to listen, and willing to give a piece of us. much more is given back to us. then something changes.
Now I feel that people's wise words find me instead. just remains to be thankful for.
Brian R Light 10+
Lindsay Newland Bowker 50+
Truth and empowerment liberate us from fear and therefore from fear based manipulations. It takes only a tiny shift, a few moments of stepping outside ideology, memes and rank opinion. Once that first stream of light breaks through we begin to be free of fear and manipulation based on fear.
Fear and manipulation are not a natural consequence of free socoety..quite the opposite .
The preservation of freedom requires us to fearless, courageous, self reliant and self regereative. When we allow ourselves to live in fear we are throwing freedom away.
Colleen Steen 500+
When we are ready, willing and able to think for ourselves, we break the cycle/loop of fear based life experience, and at that point, individuals, or groups of individuals who want to use fear to control, have no more power.
You use the example of negative political ads, and I agree that they definitely influence people, otherwise they would not be using them any more. When more people are willing to "think" for themselves, and sift through information that is not helpful to the process, those ads will no longer have any power to control.
I really believe that we are evolving to a point where humans are wanting to think and feel more for themselves, rather than be led by others who want to adversly manipulate and control:>)
Brian R Light 10+
These days we are well advised to think it through and control it where unneeded.
Colleen Steen 500+
I think/feel that fear can be as complex, or as simple as we want it to be. Anything becomes more simple when we can understand it and the underlying causes...don't you think?
I agree that there is an intuitive/instinctual fear, which alerts us to danger, as you've noted in your comment.
Our ability, as humans, to think through our fears, offers us the opportunity to understand fear and use the information appropriately (meaning useful to ourselves and others).
This evolved emotion, and the ability to think, often causes fear to become more complicated, don't you think? I believe we sometimes "think" more than necessary, and rather than reasonably, rationally sifting through information, the "thinking" can take us more into a spiral of fear.
I actually find intuitive/instinctual fear to be more reliable than the fear that is produced by "thinking"...more healthy, as you say.
Lindsay Newland Bowker 50+
Life begins where fear ends said its caption
Fear is a useless and crippling reaction..like anxiety..it is never a response or reaction that serves us or serves humanity..it is aplace of vulnerability
Fears cling to us when we cling to them
natasha nikulina 50+
Sounds great and resonates with :
" He who looses his life shall find it "
Both tell the same story : life begins when EGO dies. Fear is the dearest ego child, for it is ego, that is always threatened always insecure. Get rid of ego and fear kiss you good bye :)
Thanks, Lindsay !
Lindsay Newland Bowker 50+
Fear is ego's child"
Wonderful!!!
Thank You.
Enrico Petrucco 20+
As for the concept of constructive fear: I would argue that there is no constructive fear and it is a mistake to view any fear as constructive. Yes, indeed there is constructive mindfulness - though it need not come about from fear, nor is fear a required element in danger avoidance.
I would like to see a society that could move beyond fear control tactics, that is where I may live next.
Josh S
Yes there is fear in our society, like the fear of economic collapse and a fear of climate change.
But for almost all fears, there is an equal positive. Il give an example of the fear of eating healthy:
There is a fear in that people say 'if you dont eat right you will : be obese, diabetes, cancer, early death, etc..
However at the same time there is a positive. Those same people will offer benefits, incentives of eating healthy: 'you will be in shape, youll be attractive, you'll live longer.' At this point it is clear that there isnt just a 'politics of fear' but also a politics of benefits.
I think that if you look at everything there are positives and benefits related to it. It just depends on how you look at it and your own mindset.
Taketomo Kikuchi
To clarify the important issues, it may be useful to know that kind of fear. It could be a chance to think about our future seriously. Luckily, we can know about global problems in any place and think about them with global citizens.
Lindsay Newland Bowker 50+
Thank you for your wisdom on this.
I too bleieve that the truth, actual facts, actual information and an opportunity to discuss that with others, including others who don't share our views is the way out of fear.That is the opprtunity we have here every day at Ted Conversations.
Once actual indisputable facts are out we are invited to deliberation and discernment, if only to reconcile or realign what has been said with our ideology, beiefs, memes, opinions. And that little bit of light that shines through in that process of reconciliation opens the way out of fear and into being active, angaged alrert and aware citizens in a truly free society.
Comment deleted
Brian R Light 10+